[DF] Caltrops

[Kromm]

I should add that fantasy ninja can certainly chuck all manner of super-effective iron spikes through the air, at the ground, etc., and that's what the caltrops in DF are intended to allow. A great deal of ninja culture has naturalized in modern fantasy, including not just those spikes, but also nageteppo, phenomenally deadly TL3-4 poisons that work in tiny doses, concealed blades everywhere, and blowpipes that shoot a variety of unlikely things. It's hard to find a fantasy RPG that doesn't have blowpipes, caltrops, smoke bombs, throwing stars, etc. nowadays. Game designers customarily amplify the effectiveness of such things to give low-ST, high-DX/IQ "assassin" archetypes the ability to fight the dragons and the knights in full (mature TL4) jousting armor that also seem to be everywhere in fantasy RPGs. Such are the wages of the kitchen sink!

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Kromm

In modern times, caltrops are used mainly in a security role, and are effective against civilian vehicles with standard tires (they're not especially useful vs. solids, a CTIS, or tracks).

Unless you count hedgehogs (those giant caltrops you see in military fortifications) those are designed to stop tracks.

[Kromm]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

Unless you count hedgehogs (those giant caltrops you see in military fortifications) those are designed to stop tracks.

And anything else that rolls, I'd imagine! ;)

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by Kromm

And anything else that rolls, I'd imagine! ;)

Well, true - but for normal vehicles it's more like bollards or walls than caltrops :)

[Kalzazz]

A DF ninja with weapon master ninja with traps at stat + 2 with very fine caltrops can defeat even wearers of footwear!

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

A DF ninja with weapon master ninja with traps at stat + 2 with very fine caltrops can defeat even wearers of footwear!

Strictly speaking, I don't think placed traps benefit from the Weapon Master damage bonus. In the description, it specifies it only applies to muscle-powered melee and ranged weapons; caltrops are sorta muscle-powered, but it's the muscles of the victim, not the prospective master.

[Kuroshima]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

Strictly speaking, I don't think placed traps benefit from the Weapon Master damage bonus. In the description, it specifies it only applies to muscle-powered melee and ranged weapons; caltrops are sorta muscle-powered, but it's the muscles of the victim, not the prospective master.

It's a ninja! what more do you need? He has his caltrops painted black!

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

Strictly speaking, I don't think placed traps benefit from the Weapon Master damage bonus. In the description, it specifies it only applies to muscle-powered melee and ranged weapons; caltrops are sorta muscle-powered, but it's the muscles of the victim, not the prospective master.

Its' Dungeon Fantasy. Rule-of-Cool is kinda the point.

[Kromm]

If people don't want their ninja to be too powerful for the price, I would certainly have no problem with Traps Master [20] allowing +1 per die of damage for Traps at IQ+1, or +2 for Traps at IQ+2 or better . . . and then letting this apply even to the stuff that isn't set using the Traps skill, like caltrops hastily chucked in a fight.

And frankly, if the GM allows very fine caltrops for $250/hex (+49 CF becuase they're "other melee or thrown weapons," not swords), and players want to buy a one-use trap for $250, why not? I'd make them a ninja-only item, though.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by Kuroshima

It's a ninja! what more do you need? He has his caltrops painted black!

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Its' Dungeon Fantasy. Rule-of-Cool is kinda the point.

I wouldn't allow it any more than I'd give a Crossbow Master the damage bonus if he rigs up a trap to shoot a bolt through a doorway when it opens, of a damage bonus if someone accidentally steps on an arrow he dropped. Yes, the trap is appropriate to the character, but it's not a weapon in the sense that Weapon Master is referring.

Originally Posted by Kromm

If people don't want their ninja to be too powerful for the price, I would certainly have no problem with Traps Master [20] allowing +1 per die of damage for Traps at IQ+1, or +2 for Traps at IQ+2 or better . . . and then letting this apply even to the stuff that isn't set using the Traps skill, like caltrops hastily chucked in a fight.

This I would allow. I'd probably add that it reduces (halves?) penalties for Hastily setting traps, similar to how Weapon Master halves Fast Draw penalties.