Stealing a Reloaded Die

[Ozzmal]

Another arguement that kinda came up last night.

The Thief went to steal my reloaded die. I didnt think I could use the reloaded die to change the result (since that was the item she was stealing). But im not so sure.

[snarky]

To avoid similar issues, we've essentially "phased" the Thief's steal attempts. The Thief declares they're going to steal something, then roll the die, we pause to see if someone can/wants to change the roll of the die, and if not, the Thief takes what he wants, including a Reloaded Die.

[Ozzmal]

Originally Posted by snarky

To avoid similar issues, we've essentially "phased" the Thief's steal attempts. The Thief declares they're going to steal something, then roll the die, we pause to see if someone can/wants to change the roll of the die, and if not, the Thief takes what he wants, including a Reloaded Die.

Ahh, I just didnt know if you were allowed to use an item the thief is attempting to steal, since they were trying to steal my reloaded die. In a similiar scenario, if a thief was trying to steal my wand of dowsing, would I be allowed to play it even after shes discarded her card?

[Clipper]

I believe this comes down to the ruling of cards that can cancel others, of which there are very few. Reloaded Die can be triggered by the dice roll, cancelling that roll. Wand of Dowsing is not a card that can cancel any affect of the theft and thus you must resolve the theft attempt before you could use the item. Thus no, you wouldn't be able to use the wand once the theft has been announced.

[thedag]

I wouldn't mind seeing an official ruling on this one. I can understand the argument put forward so far with reloaded die being one ofthe few cards that can interupt. However the rules also state that you can't get rid of a card to stop a thief from stealing it so if the target card has been named as the reloaded die I can also see a good argument for not allowing it to be used as it would be getting rid of the card to prevent thief from stealing it. if a third player had a reloaded die (don't know if thats possible) then they could use that. I personally wouldlean towards saying no.

[Pleh]

I agree with Clipper on this.The rules on the Reloaded Die are very clear. Any time someone else rolls a die, you can set it to be whatever you want. Since the Thief must roll a die to determine the success of the theft, it's fair game to use the Reloaded Die to make them fail and lose a level for it (assuming they aren't level 1).

[Eben]

I disagree.

If the dice roll to steal the RD was effective, then the targeted player no longer has the Reloaded Dice to change the theft roll. If the thief was targeting something else, then the RD could be used to change that roll.

[Clipper]

Originally Posted by Eben

I disagree.

If the dice roll to steal the RD was effective, then the targeted player no longer has the Reloaded Dice to change the theft roll. If the thief was targeting something else, then the RD could be used to change that roll.

But it isn't being used to prevent it being stolen. It is being used to prevent the thief from succeeding in stealing the item and it also caused the thief to go down a level. Besides, it's not listed in the unbreakable rules section and the cards have precedence over the rules when there is a discrepancy.

Edit: Ignore that. I reread your post and realised you weren't arguing on the "can't be used to prevent it being stolen" rule like I originally thought. However, on your other point, the item isn't stolen until the roll is resolved and the use of the Reloaded Die is triggered after the die has landed on a number but before the roll effectively completes. Still, I guess an official ruling would be nice to settle the debate.

Edit 4: Ignore the rest of this post (edits 2&3), I was using old information.

Edit 2: Actually, perhaps ignore the whole thread. I just read somewhere that Reloaded Die doesn't have a listed item value (I don't have the card to check). Thus, I'm pretty sure it can't be carried as the FAQ states it must have a value listed to be considered an item. If it can't be carried, it can't be stolen.

Edit 3: And yeah, just saw confirmation threads. Reloaded Die is not an item, Loaded Die is. The Reloaded Die should thus never have been on the table in a position to be stolen.

[MunchkinMan]

Except, of course, a Reloaded Die IS an Item and every one in my database seems to have a value of 300 gold pieces. It helps to include links to the posts/threads you're referring to so we can point out how old they are, and perhaps allow us to point to where we note that Reloaded Die should be an Item and will be getting a G.P. value in the future (which has come to pass, though I can't find the post I want). In fact, any thread before May of 2010 should be confirmed before using it as the basis for one's argument, since some major rules/card changes occurred in that phase of reprints during 2010 and early 2011.

[MunchkinMan]

Unfortunately, the official answer is that I'm torn. I know I'd say that it can't be used to prevent the theft, since it's the target of the theft, but there's a part of me that believes that SJ would think it funny in just this one instance for the Reloaded Die to be used in this way. To the Brain Trust!

(I will note, however, that a Reloaded Die is not the final say on the die roll's outcome unless it's the last Reloaded Die played. A Reloaded Die can be trumped by a Loaded Die or another Reloaded Die, meaning that playing the card does not necessarily determine the final outcome of the roll, and what happens if someone else sympathizes with the Thief, or the Thief happens to have a Loaded Die? Do they get the now-used Reloaded Die, or does the card go into the discard pile and the Thief gets to not lose a Level and the knowledge of a job well half-done?)