Encumbrance of a horse

korbeau · 07-09-2011, 11:41 PM

We just end a game session and we think we miscalculated something... here's the problem.

Edbert weight 230lbs and wear an heavy armor (including heavy gauntlets, heavy plate Arms, Heavy plate legs...) for a total of 102,5lbs. Adding is equipments, he's about 375lbs.

The Horse have 24ST and possess an Horse Plate Full Barding at 90lbs ( wow! 90Lbs! Is really THAT heavy??). Edbert riding it, the horse have on his back (375+230+90=) 695lbs. The horse move at 5. Calculating the velocity, the weapon do LESS damage than when using it on battleground

Is there something we did wrong or what?? Just calculating the horse full armor (Horse plate Face Mask, Plate Full Barding, Plate Head/Neck, Plate Legging, Horsesshoes and including the war saddle, Stirrups, Saddlebag and Halter for 200lbs), how a knight can be AS good on a fight with a horse having this weight on his back???

Thanks for helping the poor Edbert

ericbsmith · 07-10-2011, 12:09 AM

Why are you adding the rider's weight twice? You have 375 plus 230, but the 375 already counts the riders weight doesn't it?

That only brings the weight down to 465, which still leaves the horse's encumbrance at heavy. What you need to do is evaluate what the horse is carrying - historically most war horses didn't wear very much armor, and most riders didn't wear full plate either. If you drop the Horse Barding that takes weight down to 375, which is Medium encumbrance and increases speed to 8. If you want speed from the horse you either need to lighten the load, buy a stronger horse, or buy a faster horse. Or some combination of all three. What you've got is a guy who can afford a Lamborghini exterior and he stuck a V4 motor in it.

Pomphis · 07-10-2011, 12:13 AM

Or a slimmer rider. 230 lb is quite a bit.

whswhs · 07-10-2011, 12:18 AM

The medievals bred really massive warhorse, the size of modern draft horses, as I understand it, to ride into battle. And then they didn't ride them around all day too; they had separate riding horses, and when they got to the battle they put on their armor, gave the riding horse's reins to their kid sidekick, got on the heavy horse, and charged. If you rode the heavy horse in full armor all day it would be too worn out for battle, and you probably would have ruined its health in the long run.

Bill Stoddard

jeff_wilson · 07-10-2011, 12:39 AM

375-230 = 145 lbs of gear sounds like way too much to be carrying into battle as well. A lance, shield, and plate should be about half that. Add a couple of heavy melee weapons, a dagger, and a water skin in case you get separated from your support and you've got all you need to meet your fate.

Ze'Manel Cunha · 07-10-2011, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whswhs

The medievals bred really massive warhorse, the size of modern draft horses, as I understand it, to ride into battle.

As I understand it, the belief that medieval warhorses were massive is just fiction, coming mostly from jousting exaggeration. All the real world barding we've all seen in museums bear that out.

That being said, if the character is at 230 lbs, which is very heavy historically, if he's wearing cheap overweight armor at 100+ lbs, and if he's burdened his horse with cheap overweight barding on top of that, plus a war saddle and loaded bags, for 200+ lbs, he'd lucky if any horse would even move under him, far less run.

Besides, that'd be too heavy for even a modern draft horse to allow on his back, he'd be better off on a mule or an ox if he's putting over 400 lbs on its back. *grin*

Realistically, you can't healthily load over 20% of a horse's weight on its back For any long length of time without it hurting, doing serious FP burn in GURPS terms, which to carry the above character and his overweight armor would mean a 2700 lbs horse.

http://www.horsesciencenews.com/hors...orse-carry.php

DanHoward · 07-10-2011, 01:30 AM

Try riding a draft horse any faster than a trot and you'll discover why they never tried breeding horses this large for battle.

OldSam · 07-10-2011, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by korbeau

Edbert weight 230lbs and wear an heavy armor (including heavy gauntlets, heavy plate Arms, Heavy plate legs...) for a total of 102,5lbs.

Wow, I'd really consider using lighter armor at some locations, that guy is fully covered in solid steel, he probably needs a crane to get on his horse anyway... =)

Personally I'd go with Medium Plate for the limbs, hands and feets as that is still _very_ good armor but it would clearly reduce the weight.

07-09-2011, 11:41 PM	#1
korbeau Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: St-Basile-Le-Grand, Qc	Encumbrance of a horse We just end a game session and we think we miscalculated something... here's the problem. Edbert weight 230lbs and wear an heavy armor (including heavy gauntlets, heavy plate Arms, Heavy plate legs...) for a total of 102,5lbs. Adding is equipments, he's about 375lbs. The Horse have 24ST and possess an Horse Plate Full Barding at 90lbs ( wow! 90Lbs! Is really THAT heavy??). Edbert riding it, the horse have on his back (375+230+90=) 695lbs. The horse move at 5. Calculating the velocity, the weapon do LESS damage than when using it on battleground Is there something we did wrong or what?? Just calculating the horse full armor (Horse plate Face Mask, Plate Full Barding, Plate Head/Neck, Plate Legging, Horsesshoes and including the war saddle, Stirrups, Saddlebag and Halter for 200lbs), how a knight can be AS good on a fight with a horse having this weight on his back??? Thanks for helping the poor Edbert

07-10-2011, 12:09 AM	#2
ericbsmith Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Binghamton, NY, USA. Near the river Styx in the 5th Circle.	Re: Encumbrance of a horse Why are you adding the rider's weight twice? You have 375 plus 230, but the 375 already counts the riders weight doesn't it? That only brings the weight down to 465, which still leaves the horse's encumbrance at heavy. What you need to do is evaluate what the horse is carrying - historically most war horses didn't wear very much armor, and most riders didn't wear full plate either. If you drop the Horse Barding that takes weight down to 375, which is Medium encumbrance and increases speed to 8. If you want speed from the horse you either need to lighten the load, buy a stronger horse, or buy a faster horse. Or some combination of all three. What you've got is a guy who can afford a Lamborghini exterior and he stuck a V4 motor in it. __________________ Eric B. Smith GURPS Data File Coordinator GURPSLand I shall pull the pin from this healing grenade and... Kaboom-baya. Last edited by ericbsmith; 07-10-2011 at 12:30 AM.

07-10-2011, 12:13 AM	#3
Pomphis Join Date: Oct 2004	Re: Encumbrance of a horse Or a slimmer rider. 230 lb is quite a bit.

07-10-2011, 12:18 AM	#4
whswhs Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Lawrence, KS	Re: Encumbrance of a horse The medievals bred really massive warhorse, the size of modern draft horses, as I understand it, to ride into battle. And then they didn't ride them around all day too; they had separate riding horses, and when they got to the battle they put on their armor, gave the riding horse's reins to their kid sidekick, got on the heavy horse, and charged. If you rode the heavy horse in full armor all day it would be too worn out for battle, and you probably would have ruined its health in the long run. Bill Stoddard

07-10-2011, 12:39 AM	#5
jeff_wilson Computer Scientist Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas	Re: Encumbrance of a horse 375-230 = 145 lbs of gear sounds like way too much to be carrying into battle as well. A lance, shield, and plate should be about half that. Add a couple of heavy melee weapons, a dagger, and a water skin in case you get separated from your support and you've got all you need to meet your fate. __________________ . Reposed playtest leader. The Campaigns of William Stoddard

07-10-2011, 01:30 AM	#7
DanHoward Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia	Re: Encumbrance of a horse Try riding a draft horse any faster than a trot and you'll discover why they never tried breeding horses this large for battle.