One shots overpower enhancers?

[AMOE]

So... in that closed topic where the lame goblin is afflicted by a -10 enhancer, then brought a few levels up by a +5 potion, it would become lvl 6 since its level can't go below 1.

However, what if it was buffed by the +5 potion, and THEN had the -10 enhancer put on it? I did read that the order things are put on a monster do not matter, but, what about in that case? would it be reduced to lvl 1, the lowest it can go, or stay at lvl 6, reflecting the above scenario?

If it is the latter, that would mean that One Shots overpower enhancers, and that thus, the enhancers need to be calculated first, and THEN the one shots, making one shots all the more powerful to have.

So, which is it?

I'm sorry if this issue was brought up elsewhere, the search function is kinda made of fail, at least, at the moment.

[MIB2826]

Take level over monster.
Add level enhancers (both positive and negative)
If this would result in a level of 0 or lower, it is 1.

Add combat bonuses (both positive and negative).

Remember: the minimum level is 1, the effective level is not.

ie Order of play is not important.

[MunchkinMan]

One-shot Items go to the side, not the Monster. Monster Enhancers, as the rules and the cards are currently written, directly affect the Monster's Level, which currently can not go below 1.

What the rules very specifically refer to when saying that order is irrelevant is Monster Enhancers, not one-shot Items. So, if you have a Level 10 Monster, and you play a -10 Enhancer and a +5 Enhancer on it, it is a Level 5 Monster: (10 + (-10 + 5)) = 10 - 5 = 5. If order mattered, the Monster could be 6, could be 5: 10 - 10 = 0 -> 1, 1 + 5 = 6; 10 + 5 = 15, 15 - 10 = 5.

We never, ever want the second situation where the numbers can come out different because of order. However, since Enhancers as they are now directly affect the Level, they need to get applied to the Monster first, then we can worry about bonuses to the side given by one-shot Items.

[AMOE]

I did understand the whole "does not go below 1" thing, I just wanted to know about the one shot items, if they were applied after, where order matters, or if, as I had read before, order would not matter, in which case, it could've resulted in a lvl 1 lame goblin, or a lvl 6.

So, enhancers are ALWAYS counted first, no matter what, and THEN one shot items. I see.


So, what would happen if this would happen;


Lame Goblin pops up. A -10 enhancer is played on it. A +5 Potion is then played on it. A -5 enhancer is THEN played on it.

Would it still be at 6, since all the enhancers would be counted before the potion? or would it go back at 1 since the 2nd negative enhancer was played after the potion, thus, making the one shot items "checkpoints" in the order of the enhancers?

[Jarlaxle]

The order the cards are played doesn't matter. When a new enhancer and one shot are played you still add the enhancers first. That's why "one-shot items effect a side not a monster" is important. Always add the monster's enhancers first. If the answer is 1 or less it equals 1. Then add/subtract any one-shots. THAT total can be less than 1. So the order the cards are PLAYED is not important unless the card says otherwise.

[AMOE]

If that is the official ruling, then that would suck, since you couldn't cancel a +5 potion with a negative enhancer of your own. You could only cancel it with another one shot item, be it annihilation, or a -5 item of your own.


In which case, One shots DO overpower enhancers, since enhancers can't modify the one shot's bonus/malus.

[bonetm]

Which game are you guys playing? I don't seem to recall any -10 one shot item. Actually, there are very few "- itens" or "- enhancers", most of them are "+"