Drow

b-dog · 02-16-2010, 01:03 AM

I think of all of the monsters created, the drow have got to be the coolest. Evil elves living in a dark fairyland below the earth is one of the things I think about first when I think about AD&D. Nothing has captured my imagination more strongly than the drow. And they weren't just black elves that behaved like orcs instead they had a style of their own that has never been presented correctly since the Vault of the Drow. They were never a race that merely adapted to life under the earth where they had logical reasons for their nasty behavior. They were fairies who were evil in every way yet they did so with gracefullness and style. They possessed a wicked beauty that reflected in all they made and possessed. On top of that they had an awesome goddess to worship, Lolth, who was the Queen of Spiders. The spider fits them well yet the drow also worshipped even cooler gods like the Elder Eye who was just Nyarlathotep in disguise.

Their vault deep below the earth was a scene of surreal beauty and dread. Vast fungus forests and an imposing city frame their realm. The underworld was truly awe inspiring and full of horrors like the mind flayer, duargar or evil dwarves and many other vile creatures. So I guess I will say that when some sort of monster book comes out I hope the drow...err...shadow elves get the treatment they deserve.

Stone Dog · 02-16-2010, 01:39 AM

On the other hand, I hope that shadow elves stay exactly the way they are. Slightly creepy and callous, but still... just elves. No nations of vicious schemers who are a threat to the overworld. Just elves who adapted to more lightless areas just like mountain elves adapted to the stony peaks.

I would prefer that SJG keeps the Banestorm definition of dark elves, but kicks it up a notch or twelve. Nothing as "in your face" as leather clad spider worshiping bondage freaks from Below, but something insidious and pervasive. Dark elves wouldn't simply be a subculture of elven racial supremacists, but would be host to a particularly malevolent, qlippothic memetic virus.

They develop the idea (delusional? Maybe...) that in one of the ages past, elves ruled the world unchallenged and unequal. They perfectly adapted to every part of the world, as evidenced by their fallen state, where sub-species from one region are succinctly different from those of a different terrain. Not simply in the manner of the usurper Man with his myriad of skin tones, but in a deeper and more profound sense.

If they could only find a way to turn the world back the way it was... when there was nothing more powerful than an elf in his prime and the gods themselves didn't turn against the majesty of their kingdoms.

So they have sold themselves to the forces of the abyss or to the machinations of the Red King or to whatever seeks to take reality apart brick by brick so that their mythic realm could rise again.

All of the elves in this conspiracy believe that they are the ones who are calling the shots when dealing with their otherworldly allies. Some of them believe that when they finally destroy all that is, what remains will be a paradise for all creatures since there is no more perfect harmony than a world ruled by elves.

The memetic virus has a hard time sinking into minds less open to unreality than the naturally fey and magical elves, but some other races who encounter this philosophy find themselves wondering in the dark... what if they are right?

----

tl;dr? All elves are a product of their ancestral environment. Dark Elves are a product of Ken Hite's influence. ;)

See GURPS: Cabal and GURPS: Horror for more on the qlippoth and the Red King.

tg_ambro · 02-16-2010, 05:03 AM

I like the second treatment of the elves better. The first one is the classic one, the second is the cool one, in my opinion. It also kind of reminds me of and issue of Neil Gaiman's Sandman, where a cat-prophet goes around calling several other cats in the night, preaching of a world where they were the top predator and man was the size of cats, and if enough cats dream the same dream at night, they will remake the world. Very good story, and very similar to this in an enjoyable way.

sieurin · 02-16-2010, 06:23 AM

Quoth my friend Johan on Drow: Drow are like the kind of punk bands that are liked by well-adjusted privileged middle-class chicks.

I must admit I mostly find Drow plain ridiculous, a weird mix of strange things they could do that PCs couldnt, added to some lame-ass fetishisation, and the worst kind of fake fantasy evil. And then Drizzt happened and they became PC-able. Oy vey...

Na, there are better evil elves, and GURPS have them both in DF and Banestorm.

Erik

The Colonel · 02-16-2010, 07:47 AM

I tend to prefer the Tad Williams style Norn/Sithi divide ... neither of them like humans very much, but the ones actively interested in genocide have a reason for it, rather than being a pack of leather perverts in it for teh evulls like the drow.

blacksmith · 02-16-2010, 09:12 AM

Blood Elves from earthdawn are kind of interesting as well.

b-dog · 02-16-2010, 09:16 AM

The drow did not wear leather, they wore chinmail and had black cloaks spun from spider webs along with black boots. They also had bucklers, crossbows and swords to use to kill others in the dungeon. They drow were to the fairy races what demons are to spirits, cold blooded evil. They were kicked out of the surface world for being wicked and now they plot revenge. I guess I like the drow because they were the real deal bad guys not just another good guy turned bad because he never got a pony for his birthday.

Here is a link that might be useful:

http://grognardia.blogspot.com/2008/...t-of-drow.html

DocRailgun · 02-16-2010, 08:55 PM

The Drow, pre-Drizzt, were very interesting. They were one of the scariest foes out there... they were skilled in combat, they had clerics and wizards, and they had no weaknesses.

Some monsters a party could blast with their mage's spells should they be tough in melee, or melee the more wizardy type of monster. But drow had spell resistance.

It sounds funny, but one of the most striking moments of my misspent youth was reading _The Soulforge_, which was a "Choose Your Own Adventure" book set on Krynn... it was Raistlin's ordeal in the Tower of High Sorcery. At one point, he was facing a drow, and couldn't hurt the thing with his magic. He had to make a deal with Fistanandilus in order to survive.

Delvidian · 02-17-2010, 09:05 PM

In my current GURPS fantasy campaign (for my 12 and 15 year old children), I'm having a lot of fun running the Forest of Doom module from Dragon magazine. The Drow are fun to run. They have smarts, paralysis poison darts, shadow-metal armor, glyphs of warding all over. Not your typical hack and slash. Even though I'm not playing D & D, I had to introduce them into my campaign: They are a fantasy classic.

02-16-2010, 01:03 AM	#1
b-dog Join Date: Nov 2006	Drow I think of all of the monsters created, the drow have got to be the coolest. Evil elves living in a dark fairyland below the earth is one of the things I think about first when I think about AD&D. Nothing has captured my imagination more strongly than the drow. And they weren't just black elves that behaved like orcs instead they had a style of their own that has never been presented correctly since the Vault of the Drow. They were never a race that merely adapted to life under the earth where they had logical reasons for their nasty behavior. They were fairies who were evil in every way yet they did so with gracefullness and style. They possessed a wicked beauty that reflected in all they made and possessed. On top of that they had an awesome goddess to worship, Lolth, who was the Queen of Spiders. The spider fits them well yet the drow also worshipped even cooler gods like the Elder Eye who was just Nyarlathotep in disguise. Their vault deep below the earth was a scene of surreal beauty and dread. Vast fungus forests and an imposing city frame their realm. The underworld was truly awe inspiring and full of horrors like the mind flayer, duargar or evil dwarves and many other vile creatures. So I guess I will say that when some sort of monster book comes out I hope the drow...err...shadow elves get the treatment they deserve.

02-16-2010, 01:39 AM	#2
Stone Dog Join Date: Feb 2008	Re: Drow On the other hand, I hope that shadow elves stay exactly the way they are. Slightly creepy and callous, but still... just elves. No nations of vicious schemers who are a threat to the overworld. Just elves who adapted to more lightless areas just like mountain elves adapted to the stony peaks. I would prefer that SJG keeps the Banestorm definition of dark elves, but kicks it up a notch or twelve. Nothing as "in your face" as leather clad spider worshiping bondage freaks from Below, but something insidious and pervasive. Dark elves wouldn't simply be a subculture of elven racial supremacists, but would be host to a particularly malevolent, qlippothic memetic virus. They develop the idea (delusional? Maybe...) that in one of the ages past, elves ruled the world unchallenged and unequal. They perfectly adapted to every part of the world, as evidenced by their fallen state, where sub-species from one region are succinctly different from those of a different terrain. Not simply in the manner of the usurper Man with his myriad of skin tones, but in a deeper and more profound sense. If they could only find a way to turn the world back the way it was... when there was nothing more powerful than an elf in his prime and the gods themselves didn't turn against the majesty of their kingdoms. So they have sold themselves to the forces of the abyss or to the machinations of the Red King or to whatever seeks to take reality apart brick by brick so that their mythic realm could rise again. All of the elves in this conspiracy believe that they are the ones who are calling the shots when dealing with their otherworldly allies. Some of them believe that when they finally destroy all that is, what remains will be a paradise for all creatures since there is no more perfect harmony than a world ruled by elves. The memetic virus has a hard time sinking into minds less open to unreality than the naturally fey and magical elves, but some other races who encounter this philosophy find themselves wondering in the dark... what if they are right? ---- tl;dr? All elves are a product of their ancestral environment. Dark Elves are a product of Ken Hite's influence. ;) See GURPS: Cabal and GURPS: Horror for more on the qlippoth and the Red King.

02-16-2010, 05:03 AM	#3
tg_ambro Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Arkham Asylum	Re: Drow I like the second treatment of the elves better. The first one is the classic one, the second is the cool one, in my opinion. It also kind of reminds me of and issue of Neil Gaiman's Sandman, where a cat-prophet goes around calling several other cats in the night, preaching of a world where they were the top predator and man was the size of cats, and if enough cats dream the same dream at night, they will remake the world. Very good story, and very similar to this in an enjoyable way. __________________ Jazama Pajama Pajama Shimera Kazam Imera Imera Kazam Pajama Shimera Kazam Pajama Pajama! Check out my blog, Ambro's Brainwaves Pretend you have telepathy, read my thoughts!

02-16-2010, 06:23 AM	#4
sieurin Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: The armpit of the Icegiant, Sweden	Re: Drow Quoth my friend Johan on Drow: Drow are like the kind of punk bands that are liked by well-adjusted privileged middle-class chicks. I must admit I mostly find Drow plain ridiculous, a weird mix of strange things they could do that PCs couldnt, added to some lame-ass fetishisation, and the worst kind of fake fantasy evil. And then Drizzt happened and they became PC-able. Oy vey... Na, there are better evil elves, and GURPS have them both in DF and Banestorm. Erik

02-16-2010, 07:47 AM	#5
The Colonel Join Date: Jul 2006	Re: Drow I tend to prefer the Tad Williams style Norn/Sithi divide ... neither of them like humans very much, but the ones actively interested in genocide have a reason for it, rather than being a pack of leather perverts in it for teh evulls like the drow.

02-16-2010, 09:12 AM	#6
blacksmith Join Date: Aug 2005	Re: Drow Blood Elves from earthdawn are kind of interesting as well.

02-16-2010, 09:16 AM	#7
b-dog Join Date: Nov 2006	Re: Drow The drow did not wear leather, they wore chinmail and had black cloaks spun from spider webs along with black boots. They also had bucklers, crossbows and swords to use to kill others in the dungeon. They drow were to the fairy races what demons are to spirits, cold blooded evil. They were kicked out of the surface world for being wicked and now they plot revenge. I guess I like the drow because they were the real deal bad guys not just another good guy turned bad because he never got a pony for his birthday. Here is a link that might be useful: http://grognardia.blogspot.com/2008/...t-of-drow.html Last edited by b-dog; 02-16-2010 at 09:52 AM.

02-16-2010, 08:55 PM	#8
DocRailgun Join Date: Jul 2006	Re: Drow The Drow, pre-Drizzt, were very interesting. They were one of the scariest foes out there... they were skilled in combat, they had clerics and wizards, and they had no weaknesses. Some monsters a party could blast with their mage's spells should they be tough in melee, or melee the more wizardy type of monster. But drow had spell resistance. It sounds funny, but one of the most striking moments of my misspent youth was reading _The Soulforge_, which was a "Choose Your Own Adventure" book set on Krynn... it was Raistlin's ordeal in the Tower of High Sorcery. At one point, he was facing a drow, and couldn't hurt the thing with his magic. He had to make a deal with Fistanandilus in order to survive.

02-17-2010, 09:05 PM	#9
Delvidian Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Verona, NJ	Re: Drow In my current GURPS fantasy campaign (for my 12 and 15 year old children), I'm having a lot of fun running the Forest of Doom module from Dragon magazine. The Drow are fun to run. They have smarts, paralysis poison darts, shadow-metal armor, glyphs of warding all over. Not your typical hack and slash. Even though I'm not playing D & D, I had to introduce them into my campaign: They are a fantasy classic.