Mecurian dissonance conditions

[Doctor Palpatine]

Recently my GM announced a ruling regarding the Mecurian dissonance conditions. One of the players whose character is a Friend of Man was working on a way in which he could incapacitate and potentially kill a human without gaining dissonance. His theory is to introduce a slow acting poison into a humans bloodstream using a small device similar to the umbrella which was used to kill Georgi Markov in 1978 (the character is a Creationist so building the device isn’t a problem). The GM has OC said that this would get around the dissonance conditions since it doesn’t involve direct violence, although to be fair it was not a final ruling and the device, and the results, has yet to be tested in play.

To my mind this is not an acceptable way of getting around the limitations inherent in Mecurians. I’m playing one myself and I’ve always viewed it as their ‘thing’; they are incomparable in social situations but their love for humanity prevents them from ever raising a hand against them. It does also involve a degree of how the Symphony views intent. Would you rule that an accidental poisoning of a human (the target being a demon) warrants dissonance?

I have accepted the ruling as it stands although I admit I’m slightly annoyed about it! I’m rather interested to find out though whether it might be considered right within the spirit and/or the rules of the game. Thoughts and theories?!

[Andygal]

While your GM of course has the right to define what does and does not count as "violence" in his game, I would have to personally say that I disagree with your GM, and I would say that poisoning somebody, even with a slow acting poison does indeed count as "violence" at least as far as Mecurian dissonance is concerned.

As far as the accidental poisoning is concerned I would personally think that it would not count as dissonant if it was a true accident. A Seraph doesn't get dissonance for being incorrect about something, only for deliberately lying.

Of course this might not be true if the Mecurian could have reasonably predicted the human getting poisoned such as if the demon in question had a human servant and was known to be extremely paranoid, if you snuck poison into food the demon was going to eat and the demon made the servant eat some, well one might make a case that the Mecurian could have predicted that the demon would make the servant taste test because that's the kind of stuff paranoid people make their servants do.

[Rocket Man]

The Mercurian dissonance condition forbids "violence," not "direct violence." I would definitely count a deliberate poisoning, however slow, as violent. In the past, sleeping darts have been counted as "violent" if I remember the FAQ correctly.


In reference to Andygal, while accidents happen, I think at a certain level carelessness is enough to count. If a Mercurian gets in a wild car chase and runs over a 16-year-old girl because he's going too fast to swerve around her, I would call that dissonant ... he acted with disregard to the humanity he's supposed to care for and is paying the price.

EDIT: And live from New York, here's a section of the FAQ that may be relevant. Note especially the first sentence of the answer:

Q: Is self-defense against a human dissonant for Mercurians?

A: If the human is damaged by something the Mercurian does, yes. Getting out of the way of an attack is not dissonant, even if the human punches the brick wall behind the angel, so long as the Mercurian didn't guide the human's fist there.

Yes, technically a Mercurian could insult and bait humans into attacking and bulling into walls or other hazards. While this is not quite dissonant, Judgment will want to have words with any Friend of Man who has this as a hobby.

EDIT 2: Also note that while "violence" may sound narrowly defined, it isn't, technically. The primary definition in the Merriam-Webster dictionary has nothing to do with motive and everything to do with methods and results: "exertion of physical force so as to injure or abuse."

[Doctor Palpatine]

Originally Posted by Rocket Man

Q: Is self-defense against a human dissonant for Mercurians?

A: If the human is damaged by something the Mercurian does, yes. Getting out of the way of an attack is not dissonant, even if the human punches the brick wall behind the angel, so long as the Mercurian didn't guide the human's fist there.

Yes, technically a Mercurian could insult and bait humans into attacking and bulling into walls or other hazards. While this is not quite dissonant, Judgment will want to have words with any Friend of Man who has this as a hobby.

Ah, thankyou. It's been a long time since I checked the FAQ.

I know our GM has previously been rather strict on our dissonace conditions, hence why I was confused as to why he would let the poison thing pass. In the past however he has ok'ed that Mecurians can order the death of humans providing that they do nothing physical themselves. Somewhat hypocritically I agree with this ruling but I'm not sure how many people would agree with me.

Rules aside I've always liked the fact that Mecurians can't harm humans because of the massive rp potential that you can get out of it. My character for example has just had a nervous breakdown because of the grief he felt over watching Hebrew children being killed by the Pharaoh's solderis and being unable to intervene due to it being God's will (the party are currently working on the Exodus project). Conversely he is surprisingly adamant that certain humans should not be allowed to live due to their irredeemable cruelties, although he feels tremendous guilt for thinking that way. Several times now he has come close to killing humans, either directly or through proxy but thus far he has remained true to his nature.

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I still disagree with the poison though!

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by Doctor Palpatine

Ah, thankyou. It's been a long time since I checked the FAQ.

My pleasure, Doc. And welcome aboard! It's always neat to see a new face on the boards. (Nothing meant against the old faces, including my own. <wink>)

[Acolyte]

I would disagree with your GM on both counts--poisoning a human and ordering the death of a human are both violent in my book and would cause dissonance. I would apply dissonance to a Mercurian who ordered the death of a human EVEN IF THE HUMAN SURVIVED.

Obviously your GM is free to do as he wishes, and if you were bringing up the matter for review I'd do it outside a game session.

The point is, Mercurians feel the unnatural death of a human to be as abhorrent as you and I see incest and eating feces, and violence toward a human as feeling up a sibling or rolling in manure. When a human is particularly horrifyingly evil, or in the heat of a pitched battle, they might see the necessity of someone else doing it but bringing themselves to do the deed would be just disturbing. And after it's done, I imagine they'd go all Crying Game and sob in the shower or something.

[Doctor Palpatine]

As an angel's resonance and disonance is obviously tied into their nature, I've always seen acting against or around it as a rare thing indeed, the ones who do it too often usually end up falling. I suppose it doesn't prohibit thinking about it but such thoughts would be classified as 'guilty thoughts'.

Originally Posted by Rocket Man

My pleasure, Doc. And welcome aboard! It's always neat to see a new face on the boards. (Nothing meant against the old faces, including my own. <wink>)

Thankyou!