Medieval Horse Types and Traits

[nik1979]

Actually a Knight doesnt have to buy it, it is usually his lord who does. This is especially true to loyal retainer knights and isnt the case from Second Sons who'se family can afford to give them the starting equipment for the job of man-at-arms.

In the Patron Advantage, the patron can provide as much as the Characters' Starting Wealth in Equipment and even more. So for 10cp all the knights standard equipment, regardless of his budget can be covered by his lord. Although some lords grant these as gifts to the knight as part of the "hiring" fee, so at 15cp (+50%) the knight starts out with equal his wealth in equipment and more depending on the lord.

The nice thing about this rule is that, it is ambigous about how much equipment. Which leaves it to your best educated guess.

Great Job Icelander :D

[Kazander]

Originally Posted by Icelander

Great Destrier
ST: 23; DX: 9; IQ: 3; HT: 12.
Will: 11; Per: 12; Speed: 5.25; Dodge: 9; Move: 7.
SM +1 (3 hexes); 1600 lbs.

Traits: Bad Temper (12); Combat Reflexes; Domestic Animal; Enhanced Move 1 (Ground Speed 16); Hooves; Lifting ST +3; Peripheral Vision; Quadruped; Weak Bite.
Skills: Brawling -12; Mount -12.
Cost: $16,000 (Basic Cost $4,000).

Huge horses such as this were actually not very common as warhorses in the medieval era. A very large man, however, might be unable to comfortably ride a smaller destrier while wearing full armour. This horse does not stand much more than 16 hands tall, but is broad-chested and muscular. The cost includes a +1 CF for War Training as well as Styling +1 (+1 CF) and Strong Specimen (+1 CF).

This has me a bit perplexed. Are you replacing the Heavy Warhorse on B460? Your Great Destrier is much more expensive, but not clearly 'better' in all ways. Wouldn't you start with the Heavy Warhorse and work your way up from there for that sort of horse?

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Kazander

This has me a bit perplexed. Are you replacing the Heavy Warhorse on B460? Your Great Destrier is much more expensive, but not clearly 'better' in all ways. Wouldn't you start with the Heavy Warhorse and work your way up from there for that sort of horse?

The Heavy Warhorse is, as far as I know, not a real animal and it is certainly not a medieval animal. It also, unaccountably, doesn't cost enough. Since war training doubles price in the Basic Set, the price appears to be only $2,500 for the horse itself, which makes little sense.

I tried to retain Basic Set stats, but its very anachronistic for medieval horses to have so little difference between the types. A basic saddle horse being 1,200 and a destrier being 2,500 before war training is not realistic. Not to mention that the 1,900 lbs. destrier flies in the face of scholarship.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by Icelander

Screwbald

A small horse that can be ridden by a small man or someone with little baggage.

FWIW, screwbald is a coloration, not a breed or type of horse. A piebald horse is blotched black and white, while a skewbald(screwbald) horse is blotched chestnut and white.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by DAlillama

FWIW, screwbald is a coloration, not a breed or type of horse. A piebald horse is blotched black and white, while a skewbald(screwbald) horse is blotched chestnut and white.

Skewbald is a colouration, indeed, but the word is attested to at least once in a count of horse types. I thought it evocative and the list was missing a small and cheap mount for travellers such as wandering friars.

A courser for the warrior
A rounsey for the squire,
A sumpter for the baggage train,
A screwbald for the friar.
But I will braid the jennet
and shine the bridle- rein
For the riding of my lady
When she is home again.

A destrier for the jousting,
A hackney for the maid
A palfrey for the princely one
Who preens it on parade.
But I will gloss the jennet
That is cosy in the hay
for the riding of my lady
In the merry month of May.

[Dalillama]

I've never seen that one before; every case I've previously encountered has been a inaccurate rendition of Skewbald of Skewball, the latter being the name of a particular racehorse.

[OldSam]

very well done, thanks for this!

will something like the 'Horse Sense'-article appear in Low Tech or one of its three accompanying add-ons?
I'd really like to see that in there...

[Jeminai]

Great article and I will be using this in my Forgotten realms game for sure.

A note on late 19th century prices of horses. i recall from my recent American History of Economics course that in the late 19th century the americal dollar could buy 1 oz of gold, meaning it was very powerful at the time which lead to many economic changes in the early 20th century.

[DungeonCrawler]

Originally Posted by Jeminai

Great article and I will be using this in my Forgotten realms game for sure.

A note on late 19th century prices of horses. i recall from my recent American History of Economics course that in the late 19th century the americal dollar could buy 1 oz of gold, meaning it was very powerful at the time which lead to many economic changes in the early 20th century.

I'll just point out that 1 oz of gold was ~$20 dollars in the late 19th and early 20th centuries, not $1. Dollar gold coins weighed in at just over 1.6 grams each, including impurities to add hardness to the coins.

And as far as I can tell, that price held from the very inception of the US dollar and eagle coins from the late 1700s until the early 1900s. There were some minor fluctuations in the gold content and some significant changes in the added metals--like silver and copper--based on metal prices, but the basic rule holds.

Still a world of difference from the price today, where a modern $25 eagle coin (they no longer use the old quarter eagle, half eagle, and double eagle terms as far as I can tell, but still have four different types of gold eagle coin) weighs in at 1/2 oz (roughly equivalent to the old eagle), but is actually valued on the market as worth ~$650 based on the metal content, instead of the $10 of the old eagle (double eagles were ~1 oz and worth $20).

Of course, actual prices in a boom town--especially a gold or silver rush town--could mean that $10 didn't buy much...at least if one wasn't a permanent resident of the town. And that wasn't always confined to boom towns...obviously wealthy folks were often charged more for the same item their servants bought at significantly lower prices. However, there were many things the servants couldn't buy at all...and those varied from just moderately expensive for the wealthy to unreal in price. Weirdly, to my mind, those unreal priced items often go up with a decrease in actual functionality.

The exception for the very wealthy seems to come from the fact that customers are competing for a limited supply. Claude--the great jeweler/fashion designer/chef/whatever--just makes a few whatevers in a year and if you have to ask how much it costs, you're automatically out of the competition. Even if Claude's products aren't really all that good, they are status symbols.

Considering how often people risked or paid with their lives or limbs to either earn or usurp the use of status symbols through history, I guess it shouldn't be too shocking to learn they'll pay cash. Lots of cash.

On the topic of horses...they did get cheaper as the supply of horses increased. And the supply increased enormously through the nineteenth century, even compared to the increasing demand for horses. But again, that's a general rule and might not have applied in a specific town at a specific time, since it is something that could vary locally, at least until the high prices paid someone to bring more horses in from elsewhere. Or the low prices paid them to take their horses elsewhere to sell.

Same rule applies to almost any commodity as long as competition is possible. But flips around and prices skyrocket once the customers are competing for a small amount of a commodity.

Even if the horse a rich man bought can't work a full day in the field, run all day across the steppe/plains, or even survive without a lush pasture and groom-filled barn, all it has to do is look good in front of a coach a few hours per week. There's other horses to do any real work around the place and to fetch groceries...if those aren't delivered by the grocer's workaday horse and cart. After all, there are only three horses that pretty in the whole darn country...and this rich guy owns one of them and everyone knows it; that's a big win to some people.

[Taillefer]

Can someone please direct me to the rules for Luxury pricing? Can't find them in the Basic Rules, can't find them in the Low-Tech book. Or perhaps I'm just missing them....?

Thanks,

T.