Very Fit and Extra Effort

[Athanbeli]

During our last session we played a lenghty fight. After a while I realize that one character's been using some kind of combat-related extra effort every single turn. When asked about it, his player told us '...I only spent 3 & 1/2 FP, since I'm VERY FIT, so I lose fatigue at half your rate...'.
We immediately kicked him out of the room.

Well, just to silence him for all of eternity: do extra effort and Very Fit relate with each other in any way?

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Athanbeli

During our last session we played a lenghty fight. After a while I realize that one character's been using some kind of combat-related extra effort every single turn. When asked about it, his player told us '...I only spent 3 & 1/2 FP, since I'm VERY FIT, so I lose fatigue at half your rate...'.
We immediately kicked him out of the room.

Well, just to silence him for all of eternity: do extra effort and Very Fit relate with each other in any way?

Not really. There are no half-points. Round towards full points.

Of course, Godlike Extra Effort raises some questions.

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Molokh

Not really. There are no half-points. Round towards full points.

Of course, Godlike Extra Effort raises some questions.

Most fatigue loss is a one-point drip, so that means Very Fit won't help you while running (though it'll improve your roll to keep you from losing fatigue in the first place) or when you're starving, or when you're carrying an extremely heavy load.

This means Very Fit is only really helpful when you're assessing the after-combat fatigue hit (light encumberance is the same as no encumberance, heavy encumberance is the same as light encumberance, and extra heavy encumberance is the same as medium encumberance) or when hiking in said encumberance levels.

I'm curious how it would interact with fatigue sapping attacks. I suppose it would depend on the nature of the attack.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Mailanka

Most fatigue loss is a one-point drip, so that means Very Fit won't help you while running (though it'll improve your roll to keep you from losing fatigue in the first place) or when you're starving, or when you're carrying an extremely heavy load.

This means Very Fit is only really helpful when you're assessing the after-combat fatigue hit (light encumberance is the same as no encumberance, heavy encumberance is the same as light encumberance, and extra heavy encumberance is the same as medium encumberance) or when hiking in said encumberance levels.

Wrong. Very Fit does help with Fatigue-over-time situations, doubling the length of FP-loss cycles for running, swimming etc. It's the one-FP losses from combat Extra Effort that it doesn't affect.

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Molokh

Wrong. Very Fit does help with Fatigue-over-time situations, doubling the length of FP-loss cycles for running, swimming etc. It's the one-FP losses from combat Extra Effort that it doesn't affect.

What's the difference?

I know that Very Fit does not apply to powers, but it explicitly applies to exertion, and by your definition, would apply to other forms of extra effort, so why wouldn't it apply to combat-based extra effort?

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Athanbeli

Well, just to silence him for all of eternity: do extra effort and Very Fit relate with each other in any way?

Not for extra effort that only costs 1 FP per attempt. Basically, Very Fit applies in two cases:
1) When the FP cost is expressed as a cost per duration, like sprinting's 1 FP/15 seconds. In this case, it doubles the duration before you take FP.
2) When a one-time FP cost is higher than 1. You always round up in GURPS, unless otherwise stated, and Very Fit doesn't state anything. So a 1 FP cost for extra effort rounds back up to 1, as Molokh said.

See this post from Kromm (http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...44&postcount=7) and the thread surrounding it, if your player needs the Official Word.

The question of Godlike Extra Effort is interesting, but I think it's inapplicable, since that sort of extra effort is pretty much always for non-mundane use, and Very Fit doesn't affect that sort of FP expenditure anyway. Although I might make an exception for someone with the Biological power source.

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

Not for extra effort that only costs 1 FP per attempt. Basically, Very Fit applies in two cases:
1) When the FP cost is expressed as a cost per duration, like sprinting's 1 FP/15 seconds. In this case, it doubles the duration before you take FP.
2) When a one-time FP cost is higher than 1. You always round up in GURPS, unless otherwise stated, and Very Fit doesn't state anything. So a 1 FP cost for extra effort rounds back up to 1, as Molokh said.

Ok, I get it now. It's not that I cut the Sprinting cost in half and then round up, it's that I double how long it takes until you pay that cost.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

The question of Godlike Extra Effort is interesting, but I think it's inapplicable, since that sort of extra effort is pretty much always for non-mundane use, and Very Fit doesn't affect that sort of FP expenditure anyway. Although I might make an exception for someone with the Biological power source.

I had an NPC who had an Unusual Background: Can use Godlike Extra Effort with mundane actions (ST, jumping, running etc.). She boasted some pretty scary numbers . . . as long as she had the FP. It was an experimental biomod. So the question is not meaningless.

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Molokh

I had an NPC who had an Unusual Background: Can use Godlike Extra Effort with mundane actions (ST, jumping, running etc.). She boasted some pretty scary numbers . . . as long as she had the FP. It was an experimental biomod. So the question is not meaningless.

Hmm. I'd probably allow Very Fit to apply, in that case. The character has paid both the UB and the cost of Very Fit, after all, so it should be reasonably balanced. Out of curiosity, what did you charge for the UB?

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

Hmm. I'd probably allow Very Fit to apply, in that case. The character has paid both the UB and the cost of Very Fit, after all, so it should be reasonably balanced. Out of curiosity, what did you charge for the UB?

5 points, for the right to spend up to 6 FP for a 6× multiplier of the extra effort bonus, IIRC. It was RPK's advice, and I think it was reasonable. She was completely built around this ability. Could run, IIRC, up to 20y/s for a half-minute. Could strike with rather high ST a couple of times. Could jump a couple of yards less than the setting's sports hoverbikes (though that was because of the first level of Super Jump).

Had base Will of 15, and 10 more levels with the 'Extra Effort Only' limitation (-80%). Energy Reserve useable exclusively for mundane extra effort (rechargeable by using special injections and 'energy drinks'). I don't remember how, but I limited something that made her pass out after EE frequently.

It was pretty neat for an NPC: I could save the party when worse came to worst, but she didn't overshadow anybody the rest of the time.