The Perfect Super Tracker?

[Der Wanderer]

OK, its a 10000000 points game so you probably dont want to tone down, however, as a GM I doubt I would allow the ability described by Kromm...

I did some SuperTrackingTM powers a while back see: here

[Kaldrin]

It depends on the flavour of the campaign, but I would say Kromm's idea is about where I was thinking if you were looking at a 1000 pt supers campaign. That's a pretty nice level for epic stuff.

If you were thinking more X-men, then you'd probably want 600-ish points.

[Kromm]

Originally Posted by Kaldrin

If you were thinking more X-men, then you'd probably want 600-ish points.

Yeah. It would be the same ability, of course, but Xavier would need to buy it via a big, inconvenient gadget to make it affordable on his points budget. :P

Seriously . . . supers in comics have this level of awareness all the time. What keeps it in check is that the "GM" (writer) enforces annoying time penalties to sort through the flood of information, makes things like Mind Shield, Obscure, and Invisibility with the Cosmic enhancement common (especially in secret bases!), and has the super periodically forget to use his ability.

[Kaldrin]

Originally Posted by Kromm

Yeah. It would be the same ability, of course, but Xavier would need to buy it via a big, inconvenient gadget to make it affordable on his points budget. :P

:)

Certain members of the X universe are an order of magnitude more powerful than their counterparts, however.

[PK]

Originally Posted by Kaldrin

It depends on the flavour of the campaign, but I would say Kromm's idea is about where I was thinking if you were looking at a 1000 pt supers campaign. That's a pretty nice level for epic stuff.

If you were thinking more X-men, then you'd probably want 600-ish points.

Maybe a bit more. 1,000 points is about right to create a middle-of-the-line Marvel superhero, including most of the X-Men. 600 points will build a second-stringer, like Daredevil or Shadowcat, just fine, as well as the cheaper X-Men, but the team definitely runs up to 1,000+ when it comes to Storm, Colossus, etc. (And Professor X is their 2,000 point Patron, IMO.) Any of the Avengers would be 1,000 to 1,500 depending on who's writing them.

(For DC, read the above identically, but triple all of the numbers.)

[Sense of Duty (Kittens)]

A character with such gnostic powers would probably also have Blind Fighting 20 as well. It may be inappropriate in terms of scale, but it seems pretty cool.

[SCHIFTY]

He'd also probably have the whole suite of ESP psionics.

[the_matrix_walker]

Originally Posted by Kromm

On 1,000 points? Forget about the Wolverine shtick. Just get Cerebro in your head:

Cosmic Tracking: Detect (Living Beings; Analyzing, +100%; Cosmic, No die roll required, +100%; Long-Range 2, +100%; Precise, +100%; Reflexive, +40%; Time-Spanning, Past & Future, +100%; World-Spanning, All, +100%) [222]. Notes: Detects any living being at any distance, in any time or plane of existence, unless protected by a Cosmic version of Obscure. No conscious action or die roll is required on your part . . . as soon as you think of someone, you know exactly where and when he is -- down to the centimeter and second! Even when you're not trying to track a specific person, you know the location of every single living being in creation, although you'll usually only care about the ones you know or who are nearby. 222 points.

If it matters that you track other things, then get these:

Cosmic Machine Sense: Detect (Machines; Analyzing, +100%; Cosmic, No die roll required, +100%; Long-Range 2, +100%; Precise, +100%; Reflexive, +40%; Time-Spanning, Past & Future, +100%; World-Spanning, All, +100%) [222]. Notes: Detects any machine at any distance, in any time or plane of existence, unless protected by a Cosmic version of Obscure. No conscious action or die roll is required on your part . . . as soon as you think of a device, you know exactly where and when it is -- down to the centimeter and second! Even when you're not trying to track a specific machine, you know the location of every single piece of machinery in creation, from the concealed pistol on the man across the room to the galaxy-eating robot in a distant parallel universe. 222 points.

Cosmic Sense of the Supernatural: Detect (Supernatural Entities; Analyzing, +100%; Cosmic, No die roll required, +100%; Long-Range 2, +100%; Precise, +100%; Reflexive, +40%; Time-Spanning, Past & Future, +100%; World-Spanning, All, +100%) [148]. Notes: Detects any supernatural entity at any distance, in any time or plane of existence, unless protected by a Cosmic version of Obscure. No conscious action or die roll is required on your part . . . as soon as you think of such a being, you know exactly where and when it is -- down to the centimeter and second! Even when you're not trying to track a specific entity, you know the location of every single supernatural being, from the demon lords in Hell to the street address of every ghost and vampire. 148 points.

If your GM allows, just make these alternative abilities:

Omniscience [297] = Cosmic Tracking [222] + Cosmic Machine Sense [222/5 = 45] + Cosmic Sense of the Supernatural [148/5 = 30]

But if you do that, then while you're tracking one of people, machines, or the supernatural, you won't have your reflexive sensitivity to the other two.

Anyway, you'll have about 700 points left over for other things. If you're worried about the GM pulling a fast one and saying that something isn't a living being, machine, or paranormal thing, then you can use some of those points to pick up things from Powers like Remote Viewing [115] and Ultra-Scan [100], so you can see everything in the world "visually" and analyze distant objects like a Star Trek scanner.

Seriously, though . . . the whole ninja-stalking-and-sneaking-with-finely-tuned-senses shtick is aiming too low on 1,000 points.

What I notice is absent here, is Selective Effect.

Is it the intent of the rules that you can look past known sources and look for specifics rather than "nearest significant source of the substance" without Selective Effect?

[Gedrin]

I can't help but think what this guy would be doing with his mental capacity if he wasn't tracking every possible being through all possible eternities. Cure cancer seems like a lightweight task by comparison.

[the_matrix_walker]

I PMed Kromm regarding Selective Effect and Analyzing, and this is what he had to say...

Originally Posted by Kromm

That's just a logical side effect of Analyzing, actually. The Cosmic included there means that IQ rolls for detailed analysis never fail, so you can instantly sort through all sources and know exactly what you've detected.

Originally Posted by Kromm

Sure he can. But now he has to roll vs. IQ for analysis – a simple Per roll for detection isn't enough. The point of Analyzing is that you don't have to attempt this roll . . . it's automatic. Adding Cosmic means that you don't even have to roll if the GM deems the necessary task to be "detailed analysis" rather than mere "analysis," which seems likely for "everybody in creation" but not for "everybody within tens of yards." The goal of my build in the quoted post was to anticipate all likely GM-imposed obstacles to be as over-the-top as possible.

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

I may have confused matters by bringing up that particular post.

Over the top examples aside, I'm trying to determine if unmodified Detect can look past known sources, or narrow it's search parameters.

Can the guy with Detect Humans look past his buddies and find someone lurking in the woods?

Can someone with Detect Metal attempt to look specifically for gold?

Does the use of Detect (actually detect all sources in range, but then) need a successful analysis roll to perform these feats?

And if not, is Selective Effect the way to do those things?

Thanks again.

Originally Posted by Kromm

Basically, Detect can detect any subset within its purview – that's why broader forms of Detect cost more, not less. What allows this to work is not excluding a known source or specifying a subset before the search starts, but making the IQ roll for analysis afterward. The simplest way for the GM to handle this is to make the Per roll, look up the margin on the Size and Speed/Range Table to find the range, and then have an IQ roll assess the nature of any appropriate targets within that radius. The better the IQ roll, the more specific the details.

I don't see how Selective Effect really fits . . . That's for active area-effect abilities, while Detect is really no more such an ability than is hearing or smell. Just as abilities with the Discriminatory modifier can't have Selective Effect, I'd say Detect cannot by virtue of making Analyzing available.

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

So Detect can in fact pick up things other than the single closest significant source of what you are detecting? The Advantage listing doesn't really read like that... It reads more like you can detect the closest thing that will set it off, and then you can make an IQ roll to analyze that (and nothing beyond it). So that if, by example, there is a pound of gold buried 20 feet from a 2 ton vein of iron, Detect Metal (by the reading in the Basic Set) would never find the gold, as the iron trumps it, and analysis only works on what you actually find.

If I'm reading your response correctly, Detect finds all instances of your subject in sense range, and then analysis (be it by IQ roll or automatically with Analyzing) sorts all that out?

Originally Posted by Kromm

I think the existing wording makes for a lousy ability, to be honest. It also leads to stupid arguments . . . "Sure, you can use Detect (Metal) just as soon as you take off all your armor."

That is correct. Honestly, would you pay 30 points for Detect (All Life) so that you can confirm that you have skin bacteria? Even with an "exclude known sources" clause, a jerk GM could have you detecting a mosquito on your helmet, a worm 10 cm from your boot, etc. I think the interpretation I gave is a lot fairer to players.