Indicating Prone in combat

Kirk · 07-23-2018, 09:29 PM

I was watching the 3 on 3 video on FB and saw/heard something about putting skull and crossbones on pieces...

We indicate prone characters by flipping the piece over, whether for HTH, or crawling, or being knocked down, etc. This works very well, I don't know if it is in the rules or is just a convention we use.

Not doing that becomes a headache and makes it difficult to determine who is standing and who is not when looking at the board.

Having skull and crossbones pieces to indicate prone dead guys is great, but if the skull and crossbones is on the back of every character that is *not* good and would require a PRONE marker to be placed on face-up characters instead.

Can someone clarify what is being considered and correct me if I misunderstood what Steve said about this in the video? I did immediately notice that they were not flipping prone characters over, and found it difficult to determine who had facing for engagement and where to apply prone DX adds. Please, let's not do this!

I would make a case for either artwork on the back side showing a prone character or leaving it blank, but *not* putting Death artwork on the back because it will confuse and slow play, if that is being considered.

Rick_Smith · 07-23-2018, 09:36 PM

I was looking over the kickstarter and saw skull and crossbones counters. I am perfectly happy turning over people to the blank side to show dead / unconscious bodies. I hope that we don't lose a lot of figures for these counters.

Counters for 'prone' could be useful, but they don't need to be a human sized square. A narrow counter with the word and an arrow to point into the next hex would be plenty.

Warm regards, Rick.

Skarg · 07-23-2018, 10:23 PM

I'd put a fallen body generic silhouette/symbol on the back side, which could be either dead or unconscious.

Playing dead is a possibility, and so is being unconscious or asleep (so not knowing by looking at the counter is appropriate).

(Also HTH, intentionally being prone to fire crossbows, etc., so non-dead counters are needed.)

Kirk · 07-23-2018, 10:41 PM

Yep, that is why we need to leave the backside as either a prone character or blank. Separate markers placed on top of a character could be used to show unconscious or dead.

Anything else makes it more difficult to monitor what is what. Being a GM handling half-a-dozen characters and knowing their status with a quick glance at the board is important.

And I wouldn't want some characters with a skull on the back and others not, for the obvious reasons.

JLV · 07-23-2018, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick_Smith

I was looking over the kickstarter and saw skull and crossbones counters. I am perfectly happy turning over people to the blank side to show dead / unconscious bodies. I hope that we don't lose a lot of figures for these counters.

Counters for 'prone' could be useful, but they don't need to be a human sized square. A narrow counter with the word and an arrow to point into the next hex would be plenty.

Warm regards, Rick.

According to what Steve said during the 3 on 3 video, the skull and crossbones will be on the back of the people counters to indicate there is now a dead body there.

Skarg · 07-23-2018, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JLV

According to what Steve said during the 3 on 3 video, the skull and crossbones will be on the back of the people counters to indicate there is now a dead body there.

But we used to flip them to mean "not standing" - so how would you indicate someone is just fallen?

JLV · 07-23-2018, 11:22 PM

Honestly, I don't know. Perhaps they'll provide us with a sheet of status markers. Or if all else fails, I'll fall back on the old wargamers' stand-by and put a penny on the figure to indicate that it's changed its status (in this case to "fallen" instead of "out of supply"). Or maybe I can just set it so that an upside down Skull and Crossbones means fallen, while one set "right side up" indicates a dead person (of course, we'll have to establish which direction is right, and which one is upside down).

Steve Jackson · 07-23-2018, 11:33 PM

Well, you're pretty much out of supply if you're dead . . . oh, never mind.

In my own games, the ambiguity of the flipped counter was a problem. In general there are a lot more bodies than living prone people. Therefore it makes sense to have the default be dead-o, and a counter (yes, half size) for prone. But we haven't prepared a mockup of that yet. Need to.

What would the arrow on a prone counter be good for? If it's placed on a face-up figure you can still read that figure's facing. Dead counters are by default prone. What have I missed?

Thank you for the comment even though I don't agree with it - I am glad to see people are watching the videos with a critical eye.

07-23-2018, 09:29 PM	#1
Kirk Join Date: Feb 2018	Indicating Prone in combat I was watching the 3 on 3 video on FB and saw/heard something about putting skull and crossbones on pieces... We indicate prone characters by flipping the piece over, whether for HTH, or crawling, or being knocked down, etc. This works very well, I don't know if it is in the rules or is just a convention we use. Not doing that becomes a headache and makes it difficult to determine who is standing and who is not when looking at the board. Having skull and crossbones pieces to indicate prone dead guys is great, but if the skull and crossbones is on the back of every character that is not good and would require a PRONE marker to be placed on face-up characters instead. Can someone clarify what is being considered and correct me if I misunderstood what Steve said about this in the video? I did immediately notice that they were not flipping prone characters over, and found it difficult to determine who had facing for engagement and where to apply prone DX adds. Please, let's not do this! I would make a case for either artwork on the back side showing a prone character or leaving it blank, but not putting Death artwork on the back because it will confuse and slow play, if that is being considered.

07-23-2018, 09:36 PM	#2
Rick_Smith Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Coquitlam B.C.	Re: Indicating Prone or dead in combat -- counters needed? I was looking over the kickstarter and saw skull and crossbones counters. I am perfectly happy turning over people to the blank side to show dead / unconscious bodies. I hope that we don't lose a lot of figures for these counters. Counters for 'prone' could be useful, but they don't need to be a human sized square. A narrow counter with the word and an arrow to point into the next hex would be plenty. Warm regards, Rick.

07-23-2018, 10:23 PM	#3
Skarg Join Date: May 2015	Re: Indicating Prone in combat I'd put a fallen body generic silhouette/symbol on the back side, which could be either dead or unconscious. Playing dead is a possibility, and so is being unconscious or asleep (so not knowing by looking at the counter is appropriate). (Also HTH, intentionally being prone to fire crossbows, etc., so non-dead counters are needed.)

07-23-2018, 10:41 PM	#4
Kirk Join Date: Feb 2018	Re: Indicating Prone in combat Yep, that is why we need to leave the backside as either a prone character or blank. Separate markers placed on top of a character could be used to show unconscious or dead. Anything else makes it more difficult to monitor what is what. Being a GM handling half-a-dozen characters and knowing their status with a quick glance at the board is important. And I wouldn't want some characters with a skull on the back and others not, for the obvious reasons.

07-23-2018, 11:22 PM	#7
JLV Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Arizona	Re: Indicating Prone in combat Honestly, I don't know. Perhaps they'll provide us with a sheet of status markers. Or if all else fails, I'll fall back on the old wargamers' stand-by and put a penny on the figure to indicate that it's changed its status (in this case to "fallen" instead of "out of supply"). Or maybe I can just set it so that an upside down Skull and Crossbones means fallen, while one set "right side up" indicates a dead person (of course, we'll have to establish which direction is right, and which one is upside down). Last edited by JLV; 07-23-2018 at 11:28 PM.

07-23-2018, 11:33 PM	#8
Steve Jackson President and EIC Join Date: Jul 2004	Re: Indicating Prone in combat Well, you're pretty much out of supply if you're dead . . . oh, never mind. In my own games, the ambiguity of the flipped counter was a problem. In general there are a lot more bodies than living prone people. Therefore it makes sense to have the default be dead-o, and a counter (yes, half size) for prone. But we haven't prepared a mockup of that yet. Need to. What would the arrow on a prone counter be good for? If it's placed on a face-up figure you can still read that figure's facing. Dead counters are by default prone. What have I missed? Thank you for the comment even though I don't agree with it - I am glad to see people are watching the videos with a critical eye.