We don't need no stinkin' Heros and Wizards

[Rick_Smith]

Originally Posted by meteoricshipyards

... So, I was wondering, does anyone have any experience with just doing away with the distinction between Wizards and Heroes? ...

Hi MeteoricShipyards,
The idea of making it easier to take spells for heroes has come up a fair number of times in this forum.

I like Chris' suggestion of taking a 5 point talent, and then letting people learn spells. (I think that experienced wizards are more powerful than experienced heroes, so wizards having to pay for the privilege of learning spells does not trouble me.)

However, what I would do would be to ask, "do I want to allow non-wizards to pick up an occasional spell?", or "do I just want to make the druid class work?"

If all you want to do is make druids work, house rule a druid class. Some spells are cheaper, some spells can't be learned, these talents cost normal, but talents for the city cost more. What ever you like. It can be balanced, or unbalanced, what ever you want to make druids fun.

If you want to allow people in general to be able to pick up a spell or two, I suggest a variation on Chris' suggestion. People can sacrifice an attribute or two at character write up to gain the ability to user magic.

No sacrifice: normal rules for heroes. spells take triple experience to learn, and spells are cast at -4 DX.

Small sacrifice: Spells take double experience to learn, and spells are cast at -2 DX.

Full sacrifice: You are a wizard and use magic at full power. (but since you sacrificed attributes, you can also learn talents normally.

(I'm being a bit vague here because I'm trying to make these suggestions so that they work with the new TFT, but I don't know the details of how that works.)

Anyway, it is your game. Don't be shy about tweaking some rules to make druids shine.

Warm regards, Rick

[KevinJ]

In my house rules there is an Adept talent which basically makes you a Wizard and able to cast spells from books and make magic items. There are also some other magic related Talents which require Adept and give various small benefits to spell casters.

With the shift from Total IQ to XP to acquire talents, this is less of a deal, although I still don't see why there should be a distinction.

[meteoricshipyards]

Originally Posted by Rick_Smith

Hi MeteoricShipyards,
The idea of making it easier to take spells for heroes has come up a fair number of times in this forum.

However, what I would do would be to ask, "do I want to allow non-wizards to pick up an occasional spell?", or "do I just want to make the druid class work?"

Just allow heroes the occasional spell (the thief example) and wizards the occasional talent (like the druid example) without breaking the bank.

I _like_ the original system. I loved the lack of leveled classes when I moved from AD&D to ITL. But I was just wondering if people had played with this aspect of the game; what are the implications.

One thing that I see is that the cost of spells become exceedingly low compared to talents, but work just fine for wizards who aren't taking talents. There are very few 3 point talents (fencing, two weapons, expert naturalist, alchemist, scholar, spying, and UC V). I don't see most spells as being at that level. And Naturalist and Animal Handling being the equivalent of 4 spells also seems a bit high. Maybe 2 IQ points per spell for heroes and one extra IQ point per talent for wizards. I'll have to think about it.

Originally Posted by Rick_Smith

(I'm being a bit vague here because I'm trying to make these suggestions so that they work with the new TFT, but I don't know the details of how that works.)

Anyway, it is your game. Don't be shy about tweaking some rules to make druids shine.

Warm regards, Rick

Thanks Rick.

Actually, I'm not running a game. Just fooling around with characters.

But I keep seeing references to some new talent attribute and have not found where that is defined. Anyone point me to what is "officially" known?

Thanks,

Tom A.

[zot]

Originally Posted by meteoricshipyards

But I keep seeing references to some new talent attribute and have not found where that is defined. Anyone point me to what is "officially" known?

Here are the new experience point rules. There's no new talent attribute though, you can just spend experience directly on talents.