Pyramid #3/83: Alternate GURPS IV

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Infornific

If you look at weight lifting records, you'll find they scale pretty closely with a 2/3 power rule.

Only for humans.

[Infornific]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Only for humans.

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Animals don't hold weight lifting contests but a lot of measure of ST (e.g., horsepower) also fit the 2/3 power model.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Infornific

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Animals don't hold weight lifting contests but a lot of measure of ST (e.g., horsepower) also fit the 2/3 power model.

Animal metabolic rate is closer to the 3/4 power. The 2/3 power is only accurate if you assume that the larger creature is simply larger, with no change in shape.

[Michael Thayne]

Kromm,

THANK YOU so much for the alternate ST article. This may very well be my favorite Pyramid article of all time. It definitely plugs a major hole in GURPS that I've been scratching my head on how to fill for a long time. If SJGames release a supplement rebuilding GURPS damage & HP around logarithmic ST, I would buy it in a heartbeat.

[Infornific]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Animal metabolic rate is closer to the 3/4 power. The 2/3 power is only accurate if you assume that the larger creature is simply larger, with no change in shape.

Ah, I see. Good point. But the thing is if we assume GURPS ST only covers excess ST, then the rate of increase should be smaller, like 1/2 power relationship, as a smaller and smaller percentage of ST is available.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Peaches

I know that it says "physical feats involving Basic Lift (pp. B349-357) continue to work as written", so can I safely assume Extra Effort and Lifting skill still work as written under the revised ST rules?

GURPS is built with an 'apply the general rule unless there is a specific rule saying otherwise' principle.

[Peaches]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

GURPS is built with an 'apply the general rule unless there is a specific rule saying otherwise' principle.

Fair enough. I'm wondering how they might function differently (if at all) under the new assumptions presented in the revised ST rules. Should Lifting skill have a soft and hard level cap? What about Extra Effort? etc.

My general line of thought is to disallow Lifting skill and Extra Effort for ST feats. IMO, If you want to lift more, buy more Lifting ST or actual ST.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Peaches

Fair enough. I'm wondering how they might function differently (if at all) under the new assumptions presented in the revised ST rules. Should Lifting skill have a soft and hard level cap? What about Extra Effort? etc.

My general line of thought is to disallow Lifting skill and Extra Effort for ST feats. IMO, If you want to lift more, buy more Lifting ST or actual ST.

Lifting provides a small percentile increase, at +5% per +1 MoS. This is very little in the big picture with quadratic or logarithmic ST. Raising the Lifting skill was dubious before, and it's even more dubious now that BL grows even faster with ST. For these reasons, I don't see a point in capping it.

[Peaches]

What I don't get though is why should the bonus to lift vary on margin of success? It would make more sense if it gave a fixed bonus according to level, say +10% at HT and +25% at HT+2. A successful roll might reduce FP loss much like Hiking/Running/Swimming.

The way Lifting skill functions just seems odd to me.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Peaches

What I don't get though is why should the bonus to lift vary on margin of success? It would make more sense if it gave a fixed bonus according to level, say +10% at HT and +25% at HT+2. A successful roll might reduce FP loss much like Hiking/Running/Swimming.

The way Lifting skill functions just seems odd to me.

It functions largely like Extra Effort, because it's more or less the skill of applying extra effort more carefully, controlledly, and safely.