[RPM] Ritual Path Magic in High Magic setting

[Walrus]

I'd like to use RPM for my setting but RPM differs a lot from canonical source, so it needs to be tweaked.

The setting itself is similar to Technomancer with Magic abiding its laws nearly as Physics and with very little odds of Magical Failures. I know it's better to be modeled by Magic As Powers but PCs are limited to weak mages so they're prone to little failures and

So, Magic there isn't so versatile while more reliable. I'd say mechanical effect is that considerable list (about of 20-30) of Everyman spells is casted with bonuses from +1 to +5 and additional up to +5 for "common" equipment (not rare and expensive grimoires, more like Magical Workspace kit) but improvised magic is at penalty or even requires Invention rules in the case of previously unknown effect. Maybe there're Grimoires for not widely-known spells, but they're more plot devices, McGuffins than a tool.

So, what is potential discount on Ritual Adept for such system?

Also, I'd like mages to depend on external energy which is much like ammo for firearms. So, no gathering ambient energy at all (maybe the world itself is like No Mana but with no magic suppresion effect, just no ambient energy, something like Very Low Mana) - mages usually rely on energy sourses though such artifacts which store magical energy are very common, much like firearms ammo in non-prohibiting countries (they're produced by holders of Primary Sources - mighty artifacts which actually produce that magical energy). Sacrificing FP and HP is rare and may lead to quirks. Inner reserve is at its place but it can't be replenished through Path of Magic because no ambient energy is presented. Though it can be replenished by touching Artifacts.

Is discount here on Ritual Adept, Magery or both?
============================================
And about Condition Rituals. Can mage "hold" blatant attack spells (with himself as a subject) with condition "When I decide to attack"?

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by Walrus

Is discount here on Ritual Adept, Magery or both?

RPM's "Magery" is really just 9 CP worth of Energy Reserve and a single Perk, per level, so it seems much more sensible to me to apply any Limitations to Ritual Adapt, as well as non-Limitation-type discounts.

However, I vaguely recall a thread from some months ago, quite possibly last year, in which the author of MH and RPM, Pee Kitty, was in favour of Limitations on Magery.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Walrus

I'd like to use RPM for my setting but RPM differs a lot from canonical source, so it needs to be tweaked.

The setting itself is similar to Technomancer with Magic abiding its laws nearly as Physics and with very little odds of Magical Failures. I know it's better to be modeled by Magic As Powers but PCs are limited to weak mages so they're prone to little failures and

So, Magic there isn't so versatile while more reliable. I'd say mechanical effect is that considerable list (about of 20-30) of Everyman spells is casted with bonuses from +1 to +5 and additional up to +5 for "common" equipment (not rare and expensive grimoires, more like Magical Workspace kit) but improvised magic is at penalty or even requires Invention rules in the case of previously unknown effect. Maybe there're Grimoires for not widely-known spells, but they're more plot devices, McGuffins than a tool.

So, what is potential discount on Ritual Adept for such system?

I wouldn't give a straight bonus like that. That amounts to everyone in the game world getting a extra +4 to +20 character points on EACH Path skill. What I would do is make "everyman" spells Lesser effects - even if they otherwise wouldn't be. So even though Fireball that inflicts 3d burning damage is a Greater Create Energy effect normally (which would cost 18 energy) if it is a "everyman" spell in your setting it would become a Lesser Create Energy (for a mere 6 energy). This gives you the effect you are going for (making magic easier for specific spells) without artifically inflating CP costs.

Bruno was toying with some ideas about no improvising here.

Originally Posted by Walrus

Also, I'd like mages to depend on external energy which is much like ammo for firearms. So, no gathering ambient energy at all (maybe the world itself is like No Mana but with no magic suppresion effect, just no ambient energy, something like Very Low Mana) - mages usually rely on energy sourses though such artifacts which store magical energy are very common, much like firearms ammo in non-prohibiting countries (they're produced by holders of Primary Sources - mighty artifacts which actually produce that magical energy). Sacrificing FP and HP is rare and may lead to quirks. Inner reserve is at its place but it can't be replenished through Path of Magic because no ambient energy is presented. Though it can be replenished by touching Artifacts.

Is discount here on Ritual Adept, Magery or both?

I've done both in my campaigns. See PK's post about limitations here.

Originally Posted by Walrus

And about Condition Rituals. Can mage "hold" blatant attack spells (with himself as a subject) with condition "When I decide to attack"?

Short answer? Yes, but they can't be the same spell. Relevant post here.

[Walrus]

And new question about the same setting which arises from previous discussion.
The main problem is to balance mage and non-mage characters while not making any of them less useful. So making some effects Lesser may make disbalance to mages side. Of course, upcoming RPM book would be appreciated a lot.

The setting is High Magic and High Tech (TL 8 High Magic Urban Fantasy) and different artifacts are as common as High-Tech gear (mainly, mundane gear is used as usual while magic is used for purposes which can't be covered by mundane means or when magic provides countermeasures against mundane threats).

So, new question is about artificiers with RPM. Is there a good way for allowing artificier to make more charms than allowed by his Thaumathology? I think of additional magical skill like Path of Creation* or Hard Technique on Thaumathology, or leveled perk which allows more charms (ideally, infinite number of charms, maybe with increasing the time of creation slightly) while they become utterly separated from creator and only under control of the wielder. What would be the costs and limits? What if charms created can be attached directly to power sources (like Powers Stones) so nearly no inner energy is required for creation like this idea:

Originally Posted by Mathulhu

Don't break Charms when they are used, have them run out of power.

Yes, they become nearly-mundane devices but they're such in the setting. The only difference is that they have in-built magical source which can be tracked much easier than mundane thing and have some other magic-related issues.

The reason to have rules for creation is that some PCs might want to be active artificiers (not background ones), otherwise I'd definitely use some economic assumptions (like Alchemy rules in DF).

*Not to change the number of magical skills I exclude Path of Undead because there are no such things approved in the setting, maybe it can be used for unique spells with invention rules, though, usually as default from Thaumathology because nobody can teach such skill.

And overall question. Does such abundance of Magical Energy artifacts change the pricing of Ritual Adept advantage? Or is it balanced with greater access to artifacts for non-mages?

[Walrus]

And additional question about RPM attack spells (yes, with abundance of energy attack spells might become more useful). Is there any way to use modified IA (for AD, RoF, Range or other modifiers) to calculate cost of the spells? I think of using the guidelines for Affliction but is this right? What about Attack Limitations? Does they reduce the cost of a spell?

[Walrus]

And one more question, about particular Ritual (isn't there a thread for questions about particular Rituals?).

If mage creates an Area of decreased temperature to infilct FP damage (Hazard: Freezing), is it right to use Greater Destroy Energy (Destroy to reduce kinetic energy of molecules) for the cost of
(5 + Area of Effect increment + FP Damage increment + 4 for 20% Freezing modifier) * 3 (1 greater effect)? Or is Freezing modifier included into greater effect? Because otherwise it's much cheaper to use Lesser Destroy Body to directly inflict general FP damage from "tireness" without blatant effect.

[Humabout]

Originally Posted by Walrus

And additional question about RPM attack spells (yes, with abundance of energy attack spells might become more useful). Is there any way to use modified IA (for AD, RoF, Range or other modifiers) to calculate cost of the spells? I think of using the guidelines for Affliction but is this right? What about Attack Limitations? Does they reduce the cost of a spell?

PK covered this here. It will also be covered again in the eagerly awaited [b]GURPS Thaumatology - Ritual Path Magic[b] book. Personally, I wish I could take a plunger to SJG's pipeline just to get this one out.

Originally Posted by Walrus

And one more question, about particular Ritual (isn't there a thread for questions about particular Rituals?).

If mage creates an Area of decreased temperature to infilct FP damage (Hazard: Freezing), is it right to use Greater Destroy Energy (Destroy to reduce kinetic energy of molecules) for the cost of
(5 + Area of Effect increment + FP Damage increment + 4 for 20% Freezing modifier) * 3 (1 greater effect)? Or is Freezing modifier included into greater effect? Because otherwise it's much cheaper to use Lesser Destroy Body to directly inflict general FP damage from "tireness" without blatant effect.

Adding the Freezing enhancement would certainly cost more. It is doing more. Also, realize that there are often multiple ways of achieving the same result. But I would say that if you get more effect, you should pay more energy period. Adding Freezing gives more effect (the FP loss is due to cold, follows additional rules, and incorporates additional hazards). It's the same reason an IA that causes FP loss with Freezing costs more than one that does not.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by Walrus

And one more question, about particular Ritual (isn't there a thread for questions about particular Rituals?).

Honestly if you tag a thread with RPM I'll poke my nose in somewhere and try to help. PK usually does the same thing if he has time so I try to help him out with answering stuff that I can.

Originally Posted by Walrus

If mage creates an Area of decreased temperature to infilct FP damage (Hazard: Freezing), is it right to use Greater Destroy Energy (Destroy to reduce kinetic energy of molecules) for the cost of
(5 + Area of Effect increment + FP Damage increment + 4 for 20% Freezing modifier) * 3 (1 greater effect)?

Greater Destroy Energy or Greater Control Energy (or Greater Create Energy or Greater Destroy Body. There are a lot of ways to do it. See below for two spells from my personal archive.

Originally Posted by Walrus

Or is Freezing modifier included into greater effect?

Nope. Not unless you include it.

Originally Posted by Walrus

Because otherwise it's much cheaper to use Lesser Destroy Body to directly inflict general FP damage from "tireness" without blatant effect.

Rituals aren't about blatant effects. They are about breaking the laws of the setting. SCAR posted a link from another thread I posted in a while back but I can't seem to find it now. This is the main thread from that post.

Bitter Cold
Spell Effects: Greater Destroy Energy.
Inherent Modifiers: Damage, Internal Fatigue (Freezing)
Greater Effects: 1 (x3).

This spell causes all subjects within a 10-yard radius to suffer 3d fatigue damage with the Freezing hazard (p. B104).

Typical Casting: Greater Destroy Energy (5) + Area of Effect, 10 yards (8) + Damage, Internal Fatigue 3d (Freezing, +20%) (12) + Subject Weight, 300 lbs. (3). 84 energy (28x3).

Induce Hypothermal Shock
Spell Effects: Lesser Destroy Energy.
Inherent Modifiers: None.
Greater Effects: 0 (x1).

This spell causes the subject to suffer from a sudden thermal shock (p. B430) for the next 30 minutes or until he makes a successful HT check.

Typical Casting: Lesser Destroy Energy (5) + Duration, 30 minutes (1) + Subject Weight, 300 lbs. (3). 10 energy (10x1).

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

but I can't seem to find it now.

The little button (looks like a "greater than sign" in a silver square) next to your name in the Quote block links back to the quoted post.

[Christopher R. Rice]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

The little button (looks like a "greater than sign" in a silver square) next to your name in the Quote block links back to the quoted post.

Whelp I feel like a idjit.