New(?) Limitation: Temporary

[Edges]

Forgive me if this is already somewhere and I just can't find it.

There are some advantages that cause a direct, permanent change to the world without an Extended Duration enhancement. It seems reasonable to me to call it a Limitation if these changes were made temporary.

Examples:
An Innate Attack that only inflicts temporary damage. After a set time, whatever damage the attack inflicted goes away.

A Healing advantage that only heals injury temporarily. After a set time, the injury returns.

These two would probably have similar or the same limitation value and duration. But the value and duration starts getting more questionable with things like Regeneration, Regrowth, Extra Life, and Unkillable. I can think of some more radical uses for such a limitation. But I'll start there. I can even see how it could be an enhancement in some situations.

Does anyone have suggestions on what the modifier value would be for such a thing? And how should I set the duration?

[the_matrix_walker]

See "Fading Spell Effects, -20%" Thaumatology P. 24

But this is the sort of thing that will have radically different effects and impact depending on the ability in question. I think -20% is fine for your examples tho.

[Edges]

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

See "Fading Spell Effects, -20%" Thaumatology P. 24

But this is the sort of thing that will have radically different effects and impact depending on the ability in question. I think -20% is fine for your examples tho.

Thanks for the tip. I'm not sure if that does the trick though. "Fading Spell Effects" specifically says that things like damage and healing don't fade. And those are the primary things I'm looking at.

At first glance, -20% seems like not enough to me. No Wounding is -50% so it shouldn't be too close to that. As a guess, I might say -30%. But it really should be a function of duration. As it aplies to healing, I could even see the limitation being quite high (-50% or maybe more). Because you're not really healed with this limitation. You just postpone the effects of injury. For things like Extra Life or Unkillable, it becomes quite a limitation. But again... function of time.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Edges

Does anyone have suggestions on what the modifier value would be for such a thing? And how should I set the duration?

I'd invert the Extended Duration modifier.

So taking it from "Damage, Permanent with Dispelling Conditions" (the default duration for Damage, as it is subject to a dispelling condition known as "healing"):
... to "Damage, 3000 minutes" would be -9%
... to "Damage, 1000 minutes" would be -23%
... to "Damage, 300 minutes" would be -33%
... to "Damage, 100 minutes" would be -41%
... to "Damage, 30 minutes" would be -47%
... to "Damage, 10 minutes" would be -52%
... to "Damage, 3 minutes" would be -56%
... to "Damage, 1 minute" would be -60%

Replace "minute" with "second" if you'd prefer to use 1 second as the base duration rather than 1 minute.

[the_matrix_walker]

Originally Posted by Edges

Thanks for the tip. I'm not sure if that does the trick though. "Fading Spell Effects" specifically says that things like damage and healing don't fade. And those are the primary things I'm looking at.

I was using it as a frame of reference actually, not suggesting using it as written.

Originally Posted by Edges

At first glance, -20% seems like not enough to me. No Wounding is -50% so it shouldn't be too close to that. As a guess, I might say -30%. But it really should be a function of duration.

I have to disagree. My first impulse for use with attacks, is that it's not even a limitation, more of a zero point feature. Consider that you can disable someone with the damage, and then decide if you really want them dead. If you do, you slit their throat, if you don't you wait for the damage to go away... Not sure if it's friend or foe? There's no ramifications for shooting first and sorting it out afterwards. A longer duration means more inconvenience for the friends, and more time to deal with the foes.

Originally Posted by Edges

As it aplies to healing, I could even see the limitation being quite high (-50% or maybe more). Because you're not really healed with this limitation. You just postpone the effects of injury. For things like Extra Life or Unkillable, it becomes quite a limitation. But again... function of time.

Here I do agree. Healing with a Cinderella clause is a bitch!

[vierasmarius]

Not sure I agree with the proposed pricing, but I definitely see use for a 1-second or even "instant" duration attack: the classic D&D-style Death spell, that has a chance to kill the victim based on their current HP, but inflicts no lasting damage if it fails. However, a duration of a minute or more doesn't significantly limit an attack on the scale of GURPS combat, it just means the surviving combatants won't have to spend weeks or months recovering.

[simulatoralive]

This reminds me of the Temporary Transport Modifier I often use with Affliction (Warp).

I ruled that as a zero point feature, the person or object teleported snaps back to their previous location after the usual Affliction duration as seen with other afflicted Advantages. This can of course be modified for a longer or shorter duration.

It works similar with Affliction (Jumper) with the target snapping back to the time/plane/universe they were originally in.

[Edges]

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

I have to disagree. My first impulse for use with attacks, is that it's not even a limitation, more of a zero point feature. Consider that you can disable someone with the damage, and then decide if you really want them dead. If you do, you slit their throat, if you don't you wait for the damage to go away... Not sure if it's friend or foe? There's no ramifications for shooting first and sorting it out afterwards. A longer duration means more inconvenience for the friends, and more time to deal with the foes.

I thought about that. I could see it being an enhancement for DF and the like. But most of the combats I see don't end with one side dead or disabled and the other standing victoriously over the bodies. They usually end with one side running away and both sides weakened by wounds for a while. If one side's injuries vanished after a short time, they would be in a position to return and mop up the other in short order. Whereas now, many fleeing parties choose never to reengage at all.

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

However, a duration of a minute or more doesn't significantly limit an attack on the scale of GURPS combat, it just means the surviving combatants won't have to spend weeks or months recovering.

And this seems negligible to you!?

[Edges]

Originally Posted by simulatoralive

This reminds me of the Temporary Transport Modifier I often use with Affliction (Warp).

I ruled that as a zero point feature, the person or object teleported snaps back to their previous location after the usual Affliction duration as seen with other afflicted Advantages. This can of course be modified for a longer or shorter duration.

It works similar with Affliction (Jumper) with the target snapping back to the time/plane/universe they were originally in.

I considered this one too. And I agree that this seems like a feature.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by Edges

And this seems negligible to you!?

Not negligible, but not a big deal on a tactical level. Anything over a minute shouldn't get more than -20% or so, IMO. And even 1 second / instant shouldn't exceed -40%, considering that No Wounding is -50%.

Temporary Healing, on the other hand, is a very big deal, especially if you retain the penalty for repeat healing of the same subject.