Pyramid #3/52: Low-Tech II

[Lamech]

Originally Posted by wgahnagl

is neat to me more as a picture of actual Arabic settlements and way-points than being a significant contribution to Ein Arris as an adventure.

That was my hope.:)

[wgahnagl]

Originally Posted by Lamech

That was my hope.:)

Then you will be pleased with it. I went into the article expecting something different, but enjoyed what I got.

[jacobmuller]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

It's probably mid-range. The powered armors tend to have more DR, implying that the limiting factor is how heavy it is, rather than hitting max thickness.

You're right, at least, I back calculated with the +50% and got a correlation with the Low-tech equivalent. The only hiccup being the High-tech item; if it was heavier or lower DR or +1TL... Anyhoo, that would mean the UT heavy clamshell could be up to 50% heavier. Don't know when I'll get time to make anything useful from it but it's a start.
Edit: bah, humbug. Using Armor Design, a TL4 DR4 steel breastplate weighs 11.2lbs and costs $15,000? LowTech, it would be 12lb and $1,500. Am I doing something wrong?

[Langy]

Originally Posted by jacobmuller

Edit: bah, humbug. Using Armor Design, a TL4 DR4 steel breastplate weighs 11.2lbs and costs $15,000? LowTech, it would be 12lb and $1,500. Am I doing something wrong?

DR4 strong steel armor covering the Chest region (a steel breastplate) is $5,300 and 9.7 lbs using the Armor Design rules, I believe.

In Low-Tech, DR 4 plate armor for the chest would cost $1,125 and weigh 9 lbs (take DR3 Light Plate and use the Heavy Plate rule to add +1 DR).

No idea why the massive difference in pricing.

[zoncxs]

Originally Posted by Langy

DR4 strong steel armor covering the Chest region (a steel breastplate) is $5,300 and 9.7 lbs using the Armor Design rules, I believe.

In Low-Tech, DR 4 plate armor for the chest would cost $1,125 and weigh 9 lbs (take DR3 Light Plate and use the Heavy Plate rule to add +1 DR).

No idea why the massive difference in pricing.

that is using Iron not steel.

page 17 of Low tech instant armor gives you the listing for using steel.

but yeah, the listing price is a little high.

I think it should be priced (Steel, Hardened) at around $200.

[Langy]

Originally Posted by zoncxs

that is using Iron not steel.

Naw, it's Steel. It's just not Hardened Steel (the TL4 item in the Armor Design Rules that costs 5x as much as normal Steel).

I think it should be priced (Steel, Hardened) at around $200.

Maybe, but the price for Hardened Steel in Low-Tech makes no sense (it shouldn't be a price multiplier if it always increases DR by 1 - it should add to price at most).

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by Langy

Maybe, but the price for Hardened Steel in Low-Tech makes no sense (it shouldn't be a price multiplier if it always increases DR by 1 - it should add to price at most).

Why? You're replacing all the lower quality material in the armor with higher quality material. The price is not a game mechanic balance feature, it's price.

[Langy]

Originally Posted by Bruno

Why? You're replacing all the lower quality material in the armor with higher quality material. The price is not a game mechanic balance feature, it's price.

Sure, that makes sense. The bit that doesn't make sense is that it's just +1 DR, and is always +1 DR. If you're replacing the material, the DR should be multiplied by some amount (the Armor Design article gives a multiplier of x1.16 or so).

If it's always +1 DR only, then it shouldn't be 'replacing the lower-quality material with higher-quality material'; it should be something like 'treating a thin section of the outer-edge of the material, but not impacting the rest of the material'. A straight addition would make more sense with the second type, since the amount of labor wouldn't change based on the amount of DR the thing already has.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Langy

Sure, that makes sense. The bit that doesn't make sense is that it's just +1 DR, and is always +1 DR.

That's because 'hardened' is actually a surface treatment (it's not all hard steel, it's surface-hardened). Using TL 6+ methods it would be a percentage increase since you can basically make arbitrarily thick layers of hard over soft, but that may not have worked at TL 3, and I have no idea if hardening using low tech methods would be more difficult on thicker sheets.

[Langy]

Originally Posted by Anthony

That's because 'hardened' is actually a surface treatment (it's not all hard steel, it's surface-hardened).

Right. This means that the price should depend upon surface area, not thickness - it should be an addition to price, not a multiplier.