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10-08-2021, 06:48 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: The Wylds of Central North Carolina
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Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
In preparation for tomorrow's game, my wife and I ran through the first encounter of "I Smell a Rat." She was playing the Swashbuckler, and I was playing a Giant Spider.
She wiped the floor with the Spider - the Spider didn't land a single hit. Has anyone used a quick contest of Attacker's attack vs defenders defense in DFRPG? I feel like it might have given the poor giant spider a chance to score at least one hit. I think I'm going to increase the number of spiders tomorrow from 1xplayer, to 1xplayer HUGE + 2xplayer Large and see how that works out. If anyone has any additional insights into tuning this combat tonight or tomorrow morning, I would be most appreciative. |
10-08-2021, 11:31 PM | #2 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
Most lamentable for the spider! But fate is against the creature. The scenario is written with the assumption that the PCs will win. The text suggests at least one huge spider per delver, as many as three. And that's just for the opening fight, a mere warm-up.
In a more "fair" fight, the spider should ambush from above, likely inflicting -2 to the prey's defense. It should try to push the PC into the webs (which could be a real fight-ender). The spider can also grapple (at +2 if the GM allows it to use 4 "arms"); that'll mess up the PC's attacks and defenses. Grapple the arm, and the PC's fancy sword is fully neutralized. I'd avoid the "quick contest of Attacker's attack vs defenders defense"; that mucks with combat overall, essentially giving every attack a free built-in Feint. There's already a proper mechanism to handle the effect: Deceptive Attack. If the spider has TH of 16, it can drop TH to 12 or 10, and give the PC a -2 or -3 on every defense. The spider can also use AoA (Determined), and convert its +4 TH bonus to another -2 on the PC's defense. (A risky move, but it's a do-or-die situation for the spider.) Lots the spider can do - but in the end, it's meant to be a challenge that DFRPG PCs can beat. It's destined to (probably) lose. The best answer is as you suggest: moar spiders. It'd be fun to hear how the spiders fare in your re-match!
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10-09-2021, 02:39 AM | #3 |
Join Date: Apr 2013
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
Also remember that the spiders can attack at reach C, while the swashbuckler probably doesn't. A party that has to keep stepping back to preserve the range can run out of room pretty quick.
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10-09-2021, 04:35 PM | #4 |
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: The Wylds of Central North Carolina
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
Ok, more spiders helped, and the actual game consisted of a Wizard, a Thief, and a Scout.
The Scout was most effective against the spiders, but the wizard helped with a command spell, and a few well placed fireballs. The Thief held her own, but didn't do that much damage. I started with 6 Huge Spiders, and one Humongous Spider, but removed on of the spiders from the conflict early on when I discovered it would be too much. I got some good feedback from my wife after the session, and I'm going to do the next game as a "flashback" to where the PCs meet their patron, and do some of the more "social" game mechanics for the new player to introduce her to it, before continuing on with the "I Smell a Rat" dungeon. As an aside, I got some pretty good feedback from the other players, and I think they're going to want a game larger in scope that just delving, so it looks like the game might be more inspired by Tolkien and less by Leiber. |
10-10-2021, 07:54 PM | #5 |
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Saint Paul, MN
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
This has usually been the case for me, too. In my own limited experience, people who want pure "dungeon fantasy" are rare. That's not how most of my groups played D&D back in the day and it's never how I've played GURPS. With that said, though, I still prefer DFRPG for most fantasy play. I have more going on in town and whatnot, but I love the streamlined rules and sharp presentation.
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12-25-2021, 03:27 AM | #6 |
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
How was the Command spell used? It sounds like you're using it against the spiders. As part of the Mind Control college, the Command spell cannot affect animals, and the Animal college belongs to druids.
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10-11-2021, 10:48 AM | #7 | |
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
Quote:
Many of the default delvers in the boxed set are surprisingly bad at this out of the box. (2018 thread) |
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12-23-2021, 11:58 AM | #8 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Saskatoon, SK
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
Quote:
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MiB 7704 Playing: GURPS Nordlond Dragons of Hosgarth Running Savage Worlds Tour of Darkness (Vietnam + Mythos) |
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12-27-2021, 08:14 PM | #9 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
I recommend simply not using that rule in DF, or really any game where unarmed attacks are expected to be relevant.
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01-07-2022, 02:15 PM | #10 | |
Join Date: Nov 2012
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Re: Combat - Quick Contest of Attack vs Active Defense
Quote:
These are all different tactics used by real-world spiders that you could exploit. Perhaps you could have a 'deceptive' spider use both a decoy spider made of silk and the desiccated body of a former adventurer, positioning the corpse to look like it is getting attacked by the decoy. The party attacks the decoy, and their weapons get stuck in the web of the decoy. Then the 'deceptive' spider drops from the ceiling/canopy where they were hiding, manipulating the web movements of the decoys like a puppeteer. Perhaps the spiders work in concert with some creature that can mimic sounds (like the real-life lyrebirds) who could mimic the sounds of people being attacked (including would effects and screams) who then share in the spoils. The sounds make the decoy trap that much more effective. There are some, admittedly not a lot, of interspecific cooperative hunters in the real world, so you aren't required to make either animal highly intelligent or their species to make it work. Good luck! |
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