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#11 |
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Saint Paul, MN
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I thought this thread might help tamp down my ABSOLUTE EAGERNESS for the new book. I was wrong.
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#12 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Portsmouth, VA, USA
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I will reveal (in general terms) 1d-1 more things. :-)
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#13 |
Join Date: Jan 2008
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#14 |
Join Date: May 2007
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I think the fundamental problem thieves have is that they spend their points becoming very good at non-combat stuff in a genre that intentionally glosses over non-combat stuff as much as possible. If looting a dungeon were played less as a smash-and-grab and more as a heist then the thief would be very effective, but such a playstyle would marginalize many of the other character types, so problems are generally resolved violently and the thief struggles to pull his weight.
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I predicted GURPS:Dungeon Fantasy several hours before it came out and all I got was this lousy sig. |
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#15 |
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Saint Paul, MN
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#16 |
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Saint Paul, MN
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Another challenge with thieves that has been discussed before (and not just in DF) is the fact that since their skills are fundamentally mundane, they can usually be replicated in other ways. There's not much that a thief can do that a well-placed spell or barbarian's axe or scout's arrow couldn't also manage. On the one hand, this is good; an adventure should be solvable with different mixes of professions. But unless the scenario is well-designed, the thief can feel a bit lackluster.
I need to think about this as I design scenarios. Targeted low or null mana areas. Occasional orichalcum and/or meteoric locks. Plenty of fragile valuables that don't play nice with the barbarian's methods. Etc. |
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#17 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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I suppose we just have a classic case here of "the GM should accommodate what the players want". If every player builds a combat specialist and is eager to vanquish bad guys, then there's no problem with planning what's foremost a game of Monster Slayers (with treasure to be gained as a sideline). But if there's even one player of a thief (or other PC) looking to do more than battle, the GM should think of it first as a game of Treasure Hunters (though still with plenty of monsters). Just a matter of adding lots of non-combat challenges requiring stealth, spying, mobility, trickery, avoidance, theft, etc. The dungeon as a heist, as you put it.
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#18 | |
Join Date: Jan 2008
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Blades In The Dark is reputedly built on top of this type of "I planned for this already" type of play, and there's no reason in principle you couldn't do it in DFRPG. In dungeon crawls, the thief does already have a Gizmos which sort of symbolizes the same thing, and access to Serendipity, but Gizmos can only produce tools, not relevant documents or contacts, and players don't control Serendipity. Also the fact that thieves have only 30 points for advantages makes it tricky to afford things like widgets and Serendipity. Point is though that magic, in particular D&D-style magic including DFRPG magic, is only good at replicating certain kinds of mundane activities. If thieves had the ability to say, "oh hey, I already have records of the last expedition to this dungeon ten years ago, and here's a map of all the monsters and secret doors from back then," they'd be useful in a way that magic can't directly replicate. (Wizard Eye can do something similar but requires FP, time, and player effort to arrange for things like ways to open doors and avoid monsters. Wizard Eye doesn't let you just skip straight to the answers like our hypothetical thief can.) Other ideas for thieves' preparations include: "My smoke-bomb distraction in the hobgoblin captain's quarters should be going off about... now." "Let him run. I already planted caltrops in that corridor." "Actually I do know how to jury-rig a wheelbarrow. It requires a wheel and fulcrum but fortunately... I have one on my saddle horse. I'll be back in a jiffy." "You don't want to go that way, believe me. There's entirely too much stabbing and crushing in that direction. I checked." Last edited by sjmdw45; 11-29-2022 at 07:37 AM. |
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#19 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Portsmouth, VA, USA
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I rolled a 4 so I guess that's three bits from the book. First come, first answered.
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#20 |
Night Watchman
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Cambridge, UK
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250-point bandits should create work for delvers as guards for merchants. This is not a request for a reveal.
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The Path of Cunning. Indexes: DFRPG Characters, Advantage of the Week, Disadvantage of the Week, Skill of the Week, Techniques. |
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