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Old 05-06-2021, 06:58 AM   #11
Stormcrow
 
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

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Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1 View Post
Return of the Jedi: Luke cutting loose on Vader is some kind of failed roll, but I'm not certain which. Maybe Berserk or Bad Temper.
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Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
Extreme and focused stressors - such as the Emperor's manipulative monologue - can sometimes cause characters to express behaviors that they don't regularly wrestle with. The throne room example is almost but not quite a match for Provoking and Taunting from Social Engineering.
I'd go even further and say it's an example of the player deciding enough is enough, I can solve this situation by attacking. The anger is just the "roleplaying" part.
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Old 05-06-2021, 10:33 AM   #12
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

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I think this example exhibits a pitfall one can run into in this sort of search: that certainly resembles failing self control for such a Disadvantage, but Luke at that point in the saga, really should not be statted with either of those.

Extreme and focused stressors - such as the Emperor's manipulative monologue - can sometimes cause characters to express behaviors that they don't regularly wrestle with. The throne room example is almost but not quite a match for Provoking and Taunting from Social Engineering.
Thanks for pointing to specific rules! I agree that many of the examples from Star Wars film are better interpreted as situational then disadvantages.

Harry Flashman is Lecherous, Richard Sharpe is Charitable but once got seduced by a French spy (he also has above-average Appearance at least to women). Both make advances on people who can make trouble for them, but only one does it habitually so has a Disadvantage.
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Old 05-06-2021, 11:55 AM   #13
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

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Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
I think this example exhibits a pitfall one can run into in this sort of search: that certainly resembles failing self control for such a Disadvantage, but Luke at that point in the saga, really should not be statted with either of those.

Extreme and focused stressors - such as the Emperor's manipulative monologue - can sometimes cause characters to express behaviors that they don't regularly wrestle with. The throne room example is almost but not quite a match for Provoking and Taunting from Social Engineering.
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Originally Posted by Stormcrow View Post
I'd go even further and say it's an example of the player deciding enough is enough, I can solve this situation by attacking. The anger is just the "roleplaying" part.
After thinking on this for a bit, I've come up with how I'd explain it in game-mechanical terms. Luke failed a Fright Check at the end of TESB, which came up with a "gain a quirk" result. That quirk was "Flirting with the dark side". He kept that all the way through ROTJ until the very end, when he finally bought it up.
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Old 05-06-2021, 01:11 PM   #14
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

Murtagh is 'getting too old for this s...' but keeps failing his Sense of Duty control rolls.
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Old 05-06-2021, 01:12 PM   #15
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

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Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1 View Post
Luke failed a Fright Check at the end of TESB, which came up with a "gain a quirk" result. That quirk was "Flirting with the dark side". He kept that all the way through ROTJ until the very end, when he finally bought it up.
I don't think Luke was interested having the power of the Dark Side. He just could see no other way to help his friends and the Rebellion than attacking. The Emperor knew this and intentionally provoked Luke to anger so he'd do it. So I don't think there's any kind of self-control roll here.

What I think Luke does have is a Sense of Duty to his friends. The Emperor is playing on that. So is Vader: when he suggests Leia could turn to the Dark Side, that's what finally pushes Luke over the edge. There's no self-control roll for a Sense of Duty.

And when Luke finally realizes that sacrificing himself to the Dark Side won't help his friends, he throws away his lightsaber, no longer the slightest bit interested or able to be provoked. Not because he bought off a disadvantage, but because his Sense of Duty no longer told him that attack would help his friends.
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Old 05-06-2021, 01:16 PM   #16
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

Jayne Cobb, Firefly, fails a Greed self-control roll when he turns in Simon and River to the feds, even though he knows he's disobeying Mal.
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Old 05-06-2021, 01:25 PM   #17
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

Of course villains often fail Bloodlust, Bully, and Obsession rolls.
(And then there are writers of fiction who also fail obsession rolls with disconcerting frequency!)

Thranduil fails on Intolerance and Thorin fails on Greed in The Hobbit.

Last edited by Donny Brook; 05-06-2021 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 05-06-2021, 01:56 PM   #18
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

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Thranduil fails on Intolerance and Thorin fails on Greed in The Hobbit.
I agree with Thorin failing a Greed check: he really should have acted better, and didn't.

I don't think I agree with Thranduil and Intolerance: he had no reason to resist being Intolerant toward the dwarves, so he was just role-playing his character correctly. Unless you mean movie-Thranduil... That probably works. It's been a while since I saw those movies.
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Old 05-06-2021, 03:01 PM   #19
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

Pretty much every vulcan in Star Trek has some explosive episode.
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Old 05-06-2021, 07:19 PM   #20
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Default Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction

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Originally Posted by Donny Brook View Post
Of course villains often fail Bloodlust, Bully, and Obsession rolls.
(And then there are writers of fiction who also fail obsession rolls with disconcerting frequency!)

Thranduil fails on Intolerance and Thorin fails on Greed in The Hobbit.
Nitpick: there isn't a Self-Control roll on Intolerance.
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