Allowed Defenses while Grappling?

[DouglasCole]

Originally Posted by LordHelmet

Did I miss something?
What is your opinion concerning this issue?

I think partly what we're seeing here is that the real world definition of "grapple" and the GURPS term of art "Grappled" mean slightly different things, which are very important in resolving this apparent discrepancy.

In the real world, if Fighter A "grapples" Fighter B in a match, he's making a grab for him, an attempt to secure control. Fighter B likely resists by making a grab for A. Some struggle ensues. Seven seconds of struggle later, B moves in, and secures A with a double-handed grip. He's ready for a takedown now, etc.

In our regular descriptive terms, they've been "grappling" each other for seven seconds. In GURPS terms, only when B achieves some level of positive control over A is he considered Grappled (capital G, game term). At that point, the odds of A overcoming B's hold on him really IS a lot lower, and in real life, some sort of "escape" move or a hold-breaker is likely required before A can "Grapple" B back.

I think what most of us think of as grappling can (perhaps unfairly) be pictured in GURPS as two guys both in range C doing not much successfully. To an observer, it might even be an exciting match. To a GURPS Player, it's boring as heck.

To that extent, it would have been interesting to distinguish a "grab" or even "holding contact" vs the GURPS term of art "Grapple," which has enough game mechanical impact to drive comparatively huge bonuses much of the time. Grapple (GURPS Term) a Leg, and you have, what, a +3 bonus to takedowns and Leg Locks or something? That can be the equivalent of 12 points of skill! A big deal.