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Old 08-03-2010, 06:40 PM   #31
roguebfl
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
No, that's a really silly way of looking at things.

You're saying that if you have someone with IQ 10 vs someone with IQ! 11 and Per 10 and Will 10 that somehow the person with IQ! 11 has some sort of disadvantage in comparison to the person with IQ 10?, that makes no sense.

Basically the whole tying Will & Per to IQ is just a bad legacy mechanic which doesn't really add anything to the system..
I will have to disagree the have a Disadvatage compared to some with IQ 11.

Just like an Elf with DX 10 has a disadvantage compared the Elven Racial trait they bought. (or No MajgerY if you want a non stat example)
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:45 PM   #32
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
Ze, I'm confused. Are you arguing that it is the way the rules read or that it is realistic?
I'm arguing for a common sense and realistic interpretation of the rules vs a lack of sense literalist misreading of the rules which result in unrealistic silliness.
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:47 PM   #33
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by roguebfl View Post
I will have to disagree the have a Disadvatage compared to some with IQ 11.

Just like an Elf with DX 10 has a disadvantage compared the Elven Racial trait they bought. (or No MajgerY if you want a non stat example)
I'm going to ignore that, since you're not making any sense and don't seem to have read what you quoted from my post.
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:52 PM   #34
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
I'm going to ignore that, since you're not making any sense and don't seem to have read what you quoted from my post.
makes sense as you're ignoring the exact same RAW

IQ! 11 is not disadvantage to IQ10.. but IS compare to IQ11

the exact say way have you buy off part of racial templates you don't want IS a disadvantage
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:53 PM   #35
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
I'm arguing for a common sense and realistic interpretation of the rules vs a lack of sense literalist misreading of the rules which result in unrealistic silliness.
Got it. Realistic, not the way the rules actually read. :bseg:
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Old 08-03-2010, 06:57 PM   #36
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
No, that's a really silly way of looking at things.

You're saying that if you have someone with IQ 10 vs someone with IQ! 11 and Per 10 and Will 10 that somehow the person with IQ! 11 has some sort of disadvantage in comparison to the person with IQ 10?, that makes no sense.
That's like asking if someone with IQ 6 is mentally handicapped compared to a dog. No. I'm saying that someone with an IQ of 11 who is so handicapped that their Willpower and Perception is only equal to that of a person with IQ 10 has a Disadvantage.


Quote:
Basically the whole tying Will & Per to IQ is just a bad legacy mechanic which doesn't really add anything to the system.
<sigh> Once again, I was answering the question asked, which is not what the rules should be, but what they are.
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:15 PM   #37
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by roguebfl View Post
makes sense as you're ignoring the exact same RAW

IQ! 11 is not disadvantage to IQ10.. but IS compare to IQ11

the exact say way have you buy off part of racial templates you don't want IS a disadvantage
*scratches head* So the person with IQ 10 is a disadvantage compared to IQ 11?

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Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
Got it. Realistic, not the way the rules actually read. :bseg:
;p

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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
That's like asking if someone with IQ 6 is mentally handicapped compared to a dog. No. I'm saying that someone with an IQ of 11 who is so handicapped that their Willpower and Perception is only equal to that of a person with IQ 10 has a Disadvantage.
Hardly, the base is 10, unless I'm dropping it below 10 how can increasing it be a disadvantage?

If you have Will 11 and Per 10 and IQ! 10 does that mean your Per 10 is a disadvantage just like your IQ! 10 is a disadvantage since you have Will 11?

If you buy up your Basic Speed does that mean your DX! is a disadvantage?
If you buy up your HP does that mean your ST! is a disadvantage?
If you buy up your FP does that mean your HT! is a disadvantage?
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:18 PM   #38
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
*scratches head* So the person with IQ 10 is a disadvantage compared to IQ 11?
if your Talking about an IQ+1 Race yes!
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:32 PM   #39
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

<MOD>

Keep it civil, guys. This is getting a bit heated for some of you. It's just a game preference issue. Deep breaths.

And if someone says something that makes you want to ignore it, please do so. That's a mature choice. But note that responding to it by telling them you're ignoring it is about as far from that as humanly possible.

</MOD>

I don't see why this is a debate, anyway. This issue boils down completely to "GM's call." I'd allow it as a GM, but I have no compelling arguments to present other than, "I'd allow it as a GM." This is basically tied to the GM's option on enforcing disadvantage limits and how s/he treats disadvantages in play. There are no explicit rules permitting or forbidding someone buying up "DX!", except for those on pp. B16-17 which restrict the degree to which secondary characteristics can deviate from attributes in a realistic game.
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:33 PM   #40
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Default Re: Improving basic attributes cheaply: ST!, DX!, IQ!, HT!

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Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
*scratches head* So the person with IQ 10 is a disadvantage compared to IQ 11?
He is at a disadvantage. But he does not have a Disadvantage.



Quote:
Hardly, the base is 10, unless I'm dropping it below 10 how can increasing it be a disadvantage?
The base is not 10. It's the character's IQ.
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