Ways for Monsters to See in the Dark

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by whswhs

Do you know of any animal that has evolved such a thing? And are there materials that can refract thermal IR similarly to visible light?

Sure, various specialized glasses. Not aware of any animals that use infrared lenses at all, pit viper pits are essentially pinhole cameras.

Originally Posted by Agemegos

The interior of the eye of a warm-bodied animal is flooded with thermal IR from the warm-opaque walls of the eye itself.

It's also filled with water that is opaque to infrared.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Sure, various specialized glasses. Not aware of any animals that use infrared lenses at all, pit viper pits are essentially pinhole cameras.

Somehow I don't think that animals would develop glass lenses. Though in an alternate paleontology where metazoans derived from glass sponges I suppose it could happen.

[Prince Charon]

Generally speaking, if I had a creature able to see in the IR band in a fantasy or horror game, I would assume that it's due to whatever power the being has (magic, psionics, spirits, et cetra), rather than trying to create a scientific justification for something that doesn't make a lot of sense.

[The Colonel]

Originally Posted by Prince Charon

Generally speaking, if I had a creature able to see in the IR band in a fantasy or horror game, I would assume that it's due to whatever power the being has (magic, psionics, spirits, et cetra), rather than trying to create a scientific justification for something that doesn't make a lot of sense.

I guess it depends whether you are dealing with an obvious supernatural critter or just some animal ... of course, this could be a signal that (setting mechanics permitting) it can be chopped up for useful power components/have its mana organ extracted.

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by whswhs

Somehow I don't think that animals would develop glass lenses. Though in an alternate paleontology where metazoans derived from glass sponges I suppose it could happen.

I mean, bizarre alien biology in the depths of an alien world is one of the features of modern folks visiting the underdark.



Though I'm also getting the feeling that taking advantage of ambient infrared involves playing a fairly active game against entropy: you pay one way, or you pay another!

Originally Posted by Prince Charon

Generally speaking, if I had a creature able to see in the IR band in a fantasy or horror game, I would assume that it's due to whatever power the being has (magic, psionics, spirits, et cetra), rather than trying to create a scientific justification for something that doesn't make a lot of sense.

This is true, but the premise is modern, scientifically minded folks delving into a fantasy world, which means I'm trying to build the setting a little more "Hard Magic" than normal. Mana is a resource that is hoarded and stored, and so senses that don't require it are nice.



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I've been thinking about what the most useful things to detect using magical vision are: oxygen looks like it might work, though they won't call it that. Water, Rock, and air all have it in different densities. Metals might also work: Iron and copper in cave walls and in creature's blood would give a lot of information. Heat... we've discussed!

[Anthony]

Based on real-world creatures that operate in the deep ocean, the main solutions are light-generating organs and sonar.

[Rupert]

Originally Posted by whswhs

Do you know of any animal that has evolved such a thing? And are there materials that can refract thermal IR similarly to visible light?

This would explain dragons with huge gemstones for eyes. Well, not the 'evolve' part, but the large IR refracting lenses part.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Rupert

This would explain dragons with huge gemstones for eyes. Well, not the 'evolve' part, but the large IR refracting lenses part.

Having infrared vision is hardly the biggest problem with large, flying, firebreathing animals (well, combining firebreathing with infravision seems a dubious design).

Passage of time (without me updating stuff) hasn't done this any favors, but my dragon flight page is still an amusing model of 'physically reasonable' dragons.

[Agemegos]

Originally Posted by Anthony

It's also filled with water that is opaque to infrared.

True.

The chambered nautilus has eyes that are open to the exterior and filled with the ambient sea-water. Perhaps something could have a similar eye open to and filled by the outside air.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Agemegos

Perhaps something could have a similar eye open to and filled by the outside air.

It's worth looking at pit viper pit organs. The main way it differs from an air-filled eye is that it doesn't have a lens, probably because that's hard to achieve biologically (other than weird glass type materials, a zone plate seems achievable biologically, though it's hard to see how it would evolve naturally).