(IW) Cyberpunk Worlds

[AlexanderHowl]

Why would anyone go to Yrth? It is a quantum sargasso, so you can only escape using nexus portals or magical spells.

[arcanus]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

Why would anyone go to Yrth? It is a quantum sargasso, so you can only escape using nexus portals or magical spells.

Very true however my point is White Star are present in both Bonaparte-4 and Yrth in a significant way, both probably Infinity covers but Homeline outworld operations on high risk worlds.

[warellis]

I've been thinking on cyberpunk worlds in Infinite Worlds. Considering they're generally TL8, with TL9 electronics, are they generally less advanced than traditional cyberpunk settings we often think of, like say Cyberpunk 2020/2077, or Shadowrun?

[TGLS]

Originally Posted by warellis

I've been thinking on cyberpunk worlds in Infinite Worlds. Considering they're generally TL8, with TL9 electronics, are they generally less advanced than traditional cyberpunk settings we often think of, like say Cyberpunk 2020/2077, or Shadowrun?

Well the 2027 limit probably warps things a little. I feel the "only TL9 electronics" might be reasonably mature, and justify all the toys like cybernetics and the like.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by warellis

I've been thinking on cyberpunk worlds in Infinite Worlds. Considering they're generally TL8, with TL9 electronics, are they generally less advanced than traditional cyberpunk settings we often think of, like say Cyberpunk 2020/2077, or Shadowrun?

Even the msot casual walk-through of UT's bioinics section will show that just TL9 stuff (and this assumes that "Electronics" covers this) is very limited.

The most Shadowrun-inspired bionics were in the 3e Ultra-tech Two and I beleive you'd have to have gone to 3e TL11 to get all of it. Even with 4e's compression of tLs there's the issue that in the late 1990s TL11 was _three_ TLs ahead.

If I was to run game with TL8 generally and TL9 electronics only I'd call it "gritty urban dydstopia" rather than "cyberpunk. Not enough cyber no matter how many punks you've got.

[warellis]

Originally Posted by TGLS

Well the 2027 limit probably warps things a little. I feel the "only TL9 electronics" might be reasonably mature, and justify all the toys like cybernetics and the like.

I kind of wonder if we're sort of similar to Shikaku-Mon, Bonaparte-4, & Cyberme in being TL8 (TL9 [insert stuff])?

Just with more environmental protections.

I kind of like to imagine smartphones possibly being something Infinity wouldn't have expected.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by warellis

I kind of wonder if we're sort of similar to Shikaku-Mon, Bonaparte-4, & Cyberme in being TL8 (TL9 [insert stuff])?

Just with more environmental protections.

I kind of like to imagine smartphones possibly being something Infinity wouldn't have expected.

<shrug> Maybe but full TL9 has a smartwatch computer with 1 Terabyte of storage. A processor big enough for a laptop or desktop should have 10x as much storage. So we're nto quite there yet.

[warellis]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

Even the msot casual walk-through of UT's bioinics section will show that just TL9 stuff (and this assumes that "Electronics" covers this) is very limited.

The most Shadowrun-inspired bionics were in the 3e Ultra-tech Two and I beleive you'd have to have gone to 3e TL11 to get all of it. Even with 4e's compression of tLs there's the issue that in the late 1990s TL11 was _three_ TLs ahead.

If I was to run game with TL8 generally and TL9 electronics only I'd call it "gritty urban dydstopia" rather than "cyberpunk. Not enough cyber no matter how many punks you've got.

I kind of feel unless the rejection issue has been solved ala Deus Ex Human Revolution, and people are more willing to display cybernetics or prosthetics openly, we won't really see open cybernetics be easily adopted.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by warellis

I kind of feel unless the rejection issue has been solved ala Deus Ex Human Revolution, and people are more willing to display cybernetics or prosthetics openly, we won't really see open cybernetics be easily adopted.

I had an unfortunate incident with an online acquantaince who was in the midst of trying to plug reaiistic ballistics (I think) into a cyberpunk setting he was working on. I happened to drop the remark that cyberpunk was an inherently unrealistic genre and he was sure that I was talking about his ballistic near-obsession.

I wasn't of course (I was actually thinking about cyberpunk politics and economics) and you've supplied another example of the way cyberpunk is unrealiitic. It assumes that the human brain comes with expansion slots and that there will be no serious compatibility issues between nervous systems and electronics.

We're almost 50 years on from the Six Million Dollar Man and we have only the simplest powered systems in artificial limbs and the little bit of neural feedback relies on sensing muscle contractions though the skin.

I've come to believe that if we ever do see surgical interface with bionics of soem sort the only way to prevent constant threat of infections would be to graft (probably cloned) skin over it so you'd never see those metal arms.

On the other hand if metal arms were possible I think you might find some humans who'd want to flaunt them. A small group but if you look at the extremes in tattoos and piercings and other things grouped under "body modifications" somebody would think a metal arm was a great fashion statement.

[warellis]

Yeah. I can believe there would be a subculture, as you say.

Of course then, the issue is how expensive are augmentations, and how much do the medical bills cost if they're not subsidized in some way? You can probably get around the issue by taking special drugs, but those cost money, and I could easily see cybernetics turning into a versus of haves vs have-nots, for the augmented.

Unless you're like Adam Jensen or JC Denton and were specially prepared from birth practically for cybernetics of some type.

Which now makes me wonder what Deus Ex's (not including Invisible War) TL would be under GURPS 4e.


And what you've said, about how unrealidtic it is to cram in all those electronics into the body safely, makes me think of another means of having cyberpunk without cybernetics. Biopunk

Because there is a Traveller setting called HOSTILE and it focuses on providing cyberpunk in a retro-80's future Earth (like say Aliens or Outlands), by having genetic enhancements be the big hot breakthrough all the corporations are pursuing, while cybernetics are in fact not a thing in-setting.