07-31-2016, 04:34 AM | #1 |
Join Date: May 2016
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Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
Something always bothered me about skeletons being Homogenous, and now I can finally put to paper why that is.
Let's start with physics. Human skeletons--dry ones anyway--are only around 20-30 lbs. As far as I know, the femurs (upper leg bones) are the only bones to stay in place without ligaments, due to being ball-and-socket joints. Without the support of magic and/or some bindings, a skeleton simply won't stand on its own, and it certainly won't be swinging any maces around! My conclusion is that skeletons are bound to the material plane by their physical shape, and they take damage more like a machine than a totally homogenous object. Even though skeletons are physically rather homogenous, being bones and marrow and whatnot, they're supported with necromantic magic, which (in my opinion) relies heavily on the physical intact-ness of the original body. As such, they need all their bones in some decent-enough condition. As they take damage, they begin to less resemble their necessary form, and if they hit -HP or fail a HT save, they fall apart! The main reason I wanted to change skeletons was the steep difference between living, unliving, and homogenous creatures. Rules for limb damage and impaling attacks really made things confusing for me. I decided to slim the whole thing down by allowing undead to be Unliving, with extra HP (over their living selves) depending on the strength of their enchantments rather than a x2 to HP. What do you think? Am I just doing the math wrong? |
07-31-2016, 07:32 AM | #2 |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
If by "doing the math wrong" you mean "visualizing the metaphysics of your game world differently than mine", perhaps, but that's not very wrong and not very math.
I agree that skeletons are clearly held together by magic, and having no muscles, are operated by magic. I come to an entirely different conclusion from that than you, however - since the 'nuts and bolts' are magic, and not attack-able, and since the "engine, gears, transmission belts, and pistons" are magic, and not attack-able, they might as well not be there for the hitting-it-with-things rules. I'm with you on the magic being entangled with symbolism, but I think that's well represented simply with Fragile (Unnatural), where needed. I've also been known to toss in Unkillable 2 and Fast Regeneration (only when dead) because skeleton bones skittering across the floor and reassembling is boss. Unfortunately one of my players has a habit of specifically collecting skeleton thigh bones and tying them up in bundles or putting them behind locked doors to interfere with this sort of effect :) On the other hand I let Dispel Magic and Static and similar effects pop skeletons really trivially.
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07-31-2016, 11:35 AM | #3 | |
Join Date: May 2016
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
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07-31-2016, 11:47 AM | #4 |
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
Fwiw, an average human skeleton comprises 13% of an average human's body. Interestingly, assuming a homogenous undead skeleton, this works out to right about 10 HP.
As for the metaphysics of it, i like homogenous for skeletons, myself. To me, there is no machine - only magically animated bones, so destroying the bones or the magic destroys the skeleton. Also, skittering terminator 2-style skeletons are awesome and henceforth stolen!
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07-31-2016, 12:09 PM | #5 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
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(Interestingly, I so fully remembered only that small vignette I couldn't remember anything else from the movie. That made it a bit difficult finding the actual title. Only Buddy Hacket being the bone's owner made it possible at all.)
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07-31-2016, 12:15 PM | #6 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
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Compared to similarly sized mammals, we are a bit bony, probably from being all precarisously stacked up vertically. Elephants', depending on source, mass in at 12-15% for bones and 16% for skeleton entire.
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07-31-2016, 05:07 PM | #7 | |
Join Date: May 2016
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
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07-31-2016, 05:24 PM | #8 |
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
Tusks are teeth not bone, so I would hope no one includes them in their calculations. Looking around, I'd think the large size differences between the two or three species of African and the one Indian elephant would all but require some variation in that. But I just used them, because the square cube law renders them the most in need of support structures making them the "boniest "extant terrestrial mammals that I know of.
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07-31-2016, 06:30 PM | #9 | |
Join Date: May 2016
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
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Suffice to say undead skeletons are easy for that system. :P |
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07-31-2016, 08:09 PM | #10 |
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Re: Undead Skeletons: Unliving or Homogenous
I did say "average" twice. I didn't think I was unclear on that point.
Interesting. Excuse me, but I need to stat up some undead elephants now.
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