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Old 07-27-2021, 11:08 AM   #1
SilvercatMoonpaw
 
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Default What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

What sorts of traits do Dungeon Fantasy character templates not have compared to ones for any other genre?

I'm asking because I want to know what I'm getting into if I use a Dungeon Fantasy template for a non-Dungeon fantasy game.
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Old 07-27-2021, 11:11 AM   #2
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

Social traits, mostly. Status, Patron, Contacts... crippling disadvantages like Lame. Anything not appropriate for 'standard fantasy' (acceleration weakness, etc.)
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Old 07-27-2021, 11:18 AM   #3
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

The main thing that you won't find on DF templates, which might show up on other published GURPS templates are advantages and disadvantages that have to do with the character's place in society or their relationships: status, reputation, dependents, patrons, etc.
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Old 07-27-2021, 12:00 PM   #4
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

I believe professional skills are largely missing, even when they would make sense as part of the character's backstory - that Knight who used to be part of the King's Army lacks Soldier, the Scout who used to be a peasant farmboy lacks Farming/Gardening, etc. In general, if it can't be used to get supplies/information for an adventure, survive and complete the adventure, or get paid for the adventure (or get paid extra), the skill typically isn't going to be present.
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Old 07-27-2021, 01:15 PM   #5
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

I think templates should be broken up anyway.

Class is pretty much what dungeon fantasy provides. It's what you do when "underground"

But some social/background templates (lens?) could be created to flesh out characters when they are not underground.

And maybe another for childhood. So how you were raised may give you a few skills that don't seem to fit anything else about you. If you were raised a farmer, ran off to become a warrior guarding caravans, and eventually became an adventurer that might be different than if you were raised in a shop where they made shoes or by a blacksmith.

I really think Dungeon Fantasy is a caricature of what most of us have played over the years. I played that other game a good bit in the 80's and 90's and it always had a lot more background and character development than Dungeon Fantasy intimates is normal. It's why I've embraced the Dungeon Fantasy books for what they are and I've decided to ignore the DFRPG.

I'm currently working on a major city in my world and I've been thinking about some lens and templates to build NPCs. I might have a program combine them randomly just as an idea generator.
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Old 07-27-2021, 02:14 PM   #6
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emerikol View Post
I really think Dungeon Fantasy is a caricature of what most of us have played over the years.
I thought that was its point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emerikol View Post
It's why I've embraced the Dungeon Fantasy books for what they are and I've decided to ignore the DFRPG.
I started this thread because I realized I'd been dismissing anything labeled "Dungeon Fantasy" as being too focused on its own genre to be worth getting for use in other kinds of games. So far they don't sound as focused as I thought: traits mentioned so far strike me as things that I might want to individualize anyway.
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Old 07-27-2021, 03:29 PM   #7
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilvercatMoonpaw View Post
I thought that was its point.
I thought it actually was about playing a traditional fantasy campaign that involved dungeon adventuring.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SilvercatMoonpaw View Post
I started this thread because I realized I'd been dismissing anything labeled "Dungeon Fantasy" as being too focused on its own genre to be worth getting for use in other kinds of games. So far they don't sound as focused as I thought: traits mentioned so far strike me as things that I might want to individualize anyway.
I definitely think you should consider the broader collection of dungeon fantasy books. There are many out there and they probably vary in value depending on your interests but I think there is something for almost anyone wanting to operate in that genre.
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Old 07-27-2021, 05:13 PM   #8
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

The DF templates are strongly focused on the things adventurers do while on adventures, most often in dungeons, but with a few adding outdoorsy and potentially town-useful abilities. If you are open to individually adding things to cover background and social traits, I think they can work fine as the basis for PCs in other pseudo-medieval and adjacent fantasy genres. They do ensure that PCs will have the necessary skills and advantages to fill their stereotypical niches.

The DF books have expanded beyond just usefulness for dungeons with titles like Sages, Taverns, Wilderness Adventures, Guilds, and the upcoming Twists from the 2021 PDF Challenge.
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Old 07-27-2021, 05:41 PM   #9
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

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Originally Posted by Mr_Sandman View Post
If you are open to individually adding things to cover background and social traits, I think they can work fine as the basis for PCs in other pseudo-medieval and adjacent fantasy genres. They do ensure that PCs will have the necessary skills and advantages to fill their stereotypical niches.
Thanks, that helps a lot.
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Old 07-27-2021, 05:45 PM   #10
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Default Re: What do Dungeon Fantasy templates lack?

My biggest complaint about DF is that it very much reflects GURPS's very personal vision of the genre, rather than actual lowercase dungeon fantasy, the actual broader genre that's a sub-genre of fantasy.

IMHO, use the templates as written as suggestions on how to build characters appropriate for dungeon crawling campaigns, but do not take them as immutable sacred scripture that must be followed to a T. Honestly, I highly suspect (and at least from anecdotal experience if nothing else) that most lowercase dungeon fantasy gaming groups are going to have far more socializing than what DF as-written assumes by default.
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