Why would wizards want wands?

[phiwum]

Originally Posted by hcobb

Walk over to the local guild and hire somebody to cast Conceal-1 through 5 for only $3 + $62 = $65 (Should the Guild casting costs at ITL 60 add in the big pile of apprentices this will take to provide 62 points of fatigue? And then their hours of resting time on the clock afterwards? Remember that the guild charges 1$ per fatigue they pay $50 for 25 fatigue * 5 (or 6) days. I.e. 3 to 4 coppers per fatigue point.)

As nobody but the dagger-staff owner is going to be hiding that dagger anywhere they won't need to roll to find it hidden on themselves.

Also very very few wizards will cast Conceal-5 from their own Mana reserves.

Originally Posted by ITL 22

If an object is to be hidden with Conceal, it must already be in a hiding place, or else it must be very small and inconspicuous.

As I read that rule, the wizard with a dagger staff but lacking Reveal/Conceal will have to visit the guild every time he wishes to hide the dagger on his person.

[hcobb]

Originally Posted by phiwum

As I read that rule, the wizard with a dagger staff but lacking Reveal/Conceal will have to visit the guild every time he wishes to hide the dagger on his person.

How much smaller than 3oz of silver do you need?

[phiwum]

Originally Posted by hcobb

How much smaller than 3oz of silver do you need?

Ignoring the implausible weight for daggers, the example given in the text is a ring. A ring is rather smaller than a dagger, no matter how thin and lightweight.

But, of course, in your games, you're the GM. I wouldn't count a dagger as small enough to be concealed without effort. A letter-size piece of paper weighs less than a ring, but if it's laying in the corner of a room, a conceal spell won't make it hard to spot, in my opinion.

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by phiwum

But I think a GM who doesn't make somewhat idiosyncratic NPCs is kinda failing. I can agree that most PCs wouldn't opt for a wand, especially if dagger staff is allowed (as RAW does). In fact, I think dagger staffs are so useful that it's hard to understand why anyone would use a hunk of wood.

Because wand are more "wizardly", and most wizards aren't murder hoboes who spend much time worrying about concealing weapons?

Seriously PC wizards are usually the weird outliers in any game, it's very rare that somebody with actual magical powers couldn't find safer, more socially acceptable, and more reliably paying work than adventuring, and most of those jobs wouldn't involve the regular risk of violence that drives so many PC build decisions.

[phiwum]

Originally Posted by malloyd

Because wand are more "wizardly", and most wizards aren't murder hoboes who spend much time worrying about concealing weapons?

Seriously PC wizards are usually the weird outliers in any game, it's very rare that somebody with actual magical powers couldn't find safer, more socially acceptable, and more reliably paying work than adventuring, and most of those jobs wouldn't involve the regular risk of violence that drives so many PC build decisions.

Oh, quite right. I meant I would think PCs would almost always opt for dagger staffs. NPCs are different.

Axly, however, suggests that a two-handed club as a staff is better than a dagger, so I could be wrong about my guess. It depends, largely, on how often HTH is threatened against a wizard.

[Skarg]

Originally Posted by hcobb

Other than social factors, why would a wandering wizard wield a wand?
Can she even take a defend option with it?
Isn't a dagger (with five conceals) just as well hidden?
If the wand doesn't even have mana then why hold it at all? (Other than to zap Brown Slimes and such.)

1) To save $100.
2) Because they just like wands.
3) For other reasons (e.g. see below).

"Can she even take a defend option with it?"
- Probably not.

"Isn't a dagger (with five conceals) just as well hidden?"
- Not necessarily. I'd say Conceal ADDS dice to attempts to detect something, but that would be on top of how naturally easy to notice something is.

"If the wand doesn't even have mana then why hold it at all? (Other than to zap Brown Slimes and such.)"
- If retaining their original / basic Wizard ability to do 1d damage by touching foes without spending 1 fatigue, for doing that.
- If your GM considers a staff an extension of the wizard's hand, for more safely casting spells that require touch.
- Because it may have other enchantments on it.
- Because you like the security feature of a staff spell, to prevent others for using those other enchantments, or just to hurt anyone who touches your staff.
- Because others don't know you don't have staff mana or other enchantments, or that you might zap them.
- Because you want to.

[pzmcgwire]

"Can she even take a defend option with it?"

If a fan or chopsticks can be used to defend, why not a wand?

https://en.baoquocte.vn/hand-fan-mar...ts-190825.html

https://martial-arts.wonderhowto.com...-weapon-75676/

A wand or chopstick is the same size as a dagger/stiletto, so I'd think a wand could be used to defend.

Maybe the opponent will be bent over laughing accounting for the defense bonus. :)

[ColinK]

Assassins.

If it's weird and magical and hidden, some assassin somewhere will think of some way to kill you with it, and escape unsuspected, of course.

[Steve Plambeck]

Skarg's list of reasons thoroughly answers the question "why", and Shostak's rosewood hairpin is a brilliant example of one such instance.

The wand can also make for a backup weapon of opportunity. Any wizard with any other size and type of Staff could always carry, and keep easily concealed, a pencil-sized piece of wood, sown perhaps into a sleeve or hem, or worn as that hairpin, and cast the Staff spell on it later under emergency conditions. Disarmed of all else and tossed in a cell without any other materials, the wizard would still be only 5 ST away from immediately creating a new wand-sized Staff. If imprisonment was long enough, it could even be charged with mana while the wizard was otherwise helpless. When the jailers came to take the prisoner to their fate, they could be in for some serious and unexpected fireworks.

And that minimum damage of 1d6 for even a pencil-sized stick has always struck me as one of the best weapons in the game.

[Bill_in_IN]

The bottom line is that a wizard's wand is an option that is available.

Like I said in response to the OP of this thread, to each their own.