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Old 12-03-2020, 02:19 PM   #1
Edges
 
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Default Nerf to Weapon Master

The damage bonus to Weapon Master seems high for some of our games. +2 per die amounts to about a 57% increase in damage. Since the weapon master has already taken combat traits, it further widens the gulf between their combat effectiveness and that of the other PCs. It's fine for some games -- not with others.

If a house rule were to limit the damage bonus to +1 per die, leave all other benefits of the advantage, and not reduce the cost of the advantage, would anything break? Or, if there really should be a cost reduction, how much? Finally, do you find the advantage to be well priced to begin with?

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Old 12-03-2020, 02:41 PM   #2
Anthony
 
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Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

I'd be tempted to just delete the lower point categories of weapon master, if you want to be a single skill weapon master just only take a single skill. Balance-wise weapon master is probably worth around [30], it's not like putting a bunch of points into weapon skill and striking strength won't also make you scary.
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Old 12-03-2020, 02:42 PM   #3
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edges View Post
T

If a house rule were to limit the damage bonus to +1 per die, leave all other benefits of the advantage, and not reduce the cost of the advantage, would anything break? Or, if there really should be a cost reduction, how much? Finally, do you find the advantage to be well priced to begin with?

Thanks!
Well, the attractiveness of WM would be roughly halved.

You could reduce cost by 50% but that would make WM even more affordable. It's one of the selling poinbts that 20pts for 1 weapon (and most people only use 1 weapon for most of their combat) is not too much to scrape up during chargen.

You'd think that 30 pts for TBAM would be almost as affordable but what TBAM gets you is much less derect and requires much more investment in uderstanding and utilizing the advanced aspects of combat. Even true for the Cinematic Skills WM would amke available to you. You'd probably spend a lot of cp trying to get good enough in those Skills and I don't see it much.

Some people do want to spend a lot of time and effort using WM benefits to get good at Rapid Strikes and similar Techniques and maneuvers but it makes my eyes glaze over.

If you don't want everybody to buy WM just ban it outright rather than nerfing it. That'd be a lot simpler. If you don't hav e alot of peopel doign multiple rapid strikes and such like it'd come to the same thing too.
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Old 12-03-2020, 02:55 PM   #4
Imbicatus
 
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Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

Weapon master is a cinematic advantage, and if it doesn’t fit with a game I would disallow it outright rather than try to muck around with the cost of removing the bonus damage. The damage is nice, but you could more easily just buy more ST/Striking ST if damage is the only concern. The reduced penalties for rapid strike and multiple parries are where it gets most of its value IMO.
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Old 12-03-2020, 02:56 PM   #5
Edges
 
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Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

These are good points.

The multiple parry and rapid strike benefits could easily be covered by higher skill. Contrary to some, these are often used benefits of the advantage in our games.

The damage bonus is somewhat of an anomaly in GURPS as its cost doesn't scale with its value. It's essentially an aspected enhancement on Striking Strength at a flat cost (i.e., a super with ST 100 is getting much more out of the advantage than Joe Average).

Maybe just disallowing it would be the way to go for certain games.
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Old 12-03-2020, 03:02 PM   #6
Imbicatus
 
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Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

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Originally Posted by Edges View Post
The damage bonus is somewhat of an anomaly in GURPS as its cost doesn't scale with its value. It's essentially an aspected enhancement on Striking Strength at a flat cost (i.e., a super with ST 100 is getting much more out of the advantage than Joe Average).

Maybe just disallowing it would be the way to go for certain games.
Of course, a super with ST 100 is going to be capped by the maximum ST of his weapon unless using a massive anime monstrosity with a minimum ST in the 40s.
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Old 12-03-2020, 03:06 PM   #7
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edges View Post
The damage bonus is somewhat of an anomaly in GURPS as its cost doesn't scale with its value. It's essentially an aspected enhancement on Striking Strength at a flat cost (i.e., a super with ST 100 is getting much more out of the advantage than Joe Average).
The bonus for WM simply mimics the damage bonus you get for the unarmed combat skills. so its "Martial Arts for weapons" rather than some convoluted form of Striking ST.

It also goes along with the way damage bonuses are calculated for AOA(Strong) and things like that. It's probably just how bonuses work in 4e. Not everything is an exercise in Powers.
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Old 12-03-2020, 03:19 PM   #8
AlexanderHowl
 
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Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

WM becomes interesting when you have strong characters. For example, let us say that you have a character ST 18, DX 12, HT 12, Combat Reflexes, Wealth (Comfortable), WM (Edged Rapier), Rapier-22, and an edged rapier. For 225 CP, you have a character who deals 3d+6 cutting damage at Reach 1,2 with an edged rapier up to three times per turn with an effective skill of 16 and possesses a decent defense.
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Old 12-04-2020, 07:09 AM   #9
Kalzazz
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

The lower damage could make it cheaper or it could just be 'this is now how it works don't like it don't buy it'

You could also try using 3e style Skill/5 damage bonus which ties it directly to skill instead of ST for how much bonus you get
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Old 12-04-2020, 07:11 AM   #10
Anders
 
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Default Re: Nerf to Weapon Master

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Originally Posted by Imbicatus View Post
Of course, a super with ST 100 is going to be capped by the maximum ST of his weapon unless using a massive anime monstrosity with a minimum ST in the 40s.
That's why you use a shield. There's a shield mod in Low-Tech that does sw-2 cut and shields don't have ST requirements...
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