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Old 08-12-2021, 04:32 AM   #1
smin32
 
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Default Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

Hello, dear GURPS users from all over the world. My name is Smin, who has been using GURPS in Korea for 6 years.
Last year I started a campaign for a multidimensional world with a Wuxia-themed heroic archer character.
This campaign utilizes the Korean translation of the GURPS Basic Set, GURPS Martial Arts, GURPS Night of Hunters (this is the English version of the GURPS Monster Hunters series from Volumes 1 to 4), and GURPS Powers.

My question is this.

Under the rules of GURPS, is there any way for a character to fire 3 or more arrows in a single shot?
I would like to know if there is a rule in a GURPS work previously published by Steve Jackson Games that allows me to take these actions without using the Innate Attack or Extra Attack advantages.

What I want is to recreate the scene in the Tollywood movie "Bahubali 2: The Conclusion" where the main character, Amarendra Bahubali, fires three arrows at the same time.
Please see the YouTube link below.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z1bv8CtQxs
Of course, this scene is not based on Chinese content, but I think the same principle could be used to create a Wuxia-themed action scene.

Before writing this thread, I had already googled several times to see the discussions in the forums, but I still couldn't find the answer I was looking for.
I've read the description for the Dual-Weapon Attack (Bow) technique before, but it didn't say how to shoot more than 3 arrows.

I'm already using the Qucik-Shooting Bows rule (GURPS MA p.119), so I don't need to explain that part.

I'm not planning on using the house rule to solve it.
I'd like to borrow the wisdom of some of your more experienced, so please, if you have any information on the above, please let me know.
If you know of a supplement with relevant information, or a thread with an answer, just a link or name would be appreciated.

Since I am not good at English, the entire contents of the above post were written using Google Translate.
Please forgive me if the grammar is wrong.
Starting with this thread, I hope that I will be able to interact with you frequently and on various topics.
Once again, nice to meet you guys!

Last edited by smin32; 08-12-2021 at 04:55 AM.
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Old 08-12-2021, 05:09 AM   #2
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

I believe it's an option for the Scout in one of the GURPS DF books, or Pyramid #3 articles for DF, but couldn't find it out of hand.
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Old 08-12-2021, 05:14 AM   #3
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

One option would be the "multi-shot" imbuement described in the supplement

GURPS_Power-Ups_1_Imbuements

Otherwise, you could expand the Dual-Weapon Attack(bow) technique into a Multi-shot technique, with additional penalties, but I don't think there is a published example.
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Old 08-12-2021, 05:21 AM   #4
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taneli View Post
I believe it's an option for the Scout in one of the GURPS DF books, or Pyramid #3 articles for DF, but couldn't find it out of hand.
Thank you, Taneli.
I'll do some research based on the information you've given me.
If any new information comes to mind, please let me know.
it will be a lot of help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Celjabba View Post
One option would be the "multi-shot" imbuement described in the supplement

GURPS_Power-Ups_1_Imbuements

Otherwise, you could expand the Dual-Weapon Attack(bow) technique into a Multi-shot technique, with additional penalties, but I don't think there is a published example.
Thank you, Celjabba.
Unfortunately, though, it's unclear whether what you're saying can be applied because the masters of this campaign have refused to use GURPS works that are not translated into Korean.
Apart from that, thanks again for your reply.
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Old 08-12-2021, 05:48 AM   #5
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

Quote:
Originally Posted by smin32 View Post
Unfortunately, though, it's unclear whether what you're saying can be applied because the masters of this campaign have refused to use GURPS works that are not translated into Korean.
Apart from that, thanks again for your reply.
I don't know if GURPS Martial Arts has a Korean translation, but it seems like you should be able to adapt the rules for Combinations from there in this case. That basically lets you extend Dual Weapon Attack (combining it with Rapid Strike, but it should work here as well). Two attacks is at -4 (as normal), three attacks is at -9, four attacks is at -15, and from there on it's -6 per additional attack, as per normal Rapid Strike rules. This can be bought off as a Technique (with a small additional cost), although you typically are required to define where each attack is aimed when you create the Combination.

Personally, I'd be more inclined to just let you keep piling on arrows, at -4 to all attacks per arrow beyond the first (so -4 for two, -8 for three, -12 for four, and so forth), and just let you extend the Dual Weapon Attack Technique to cover however many arrows you're willing to pay for (if you've put [12] in it, you can shoot two arrows at +0 each, three at +0 each, four at -1 each, five at -5 each, and so forth). Realistically, more arrows should mean less damage per arrow, but that can be safely ignored in a cinematic campaign (although you may wish to require characters to have Heroic Archer and/or Weapon Master: Bow to be able to pull off such feats).
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Old 08-12-2021, 07:21 AM   #6
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

Dungeon Fantasy 11: Power-Ups has the Double-Shot ability, which draws and fires two arrows at once.

You specifically mention wanting to fire 3+ arrows, though, so maybe you're already using this? (If so... perhaps it can be adapted for use with 3+ arrows.)
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Old 08-12-2021, 07:41 AM   #7
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

GURPS Low-Tech, page 78, has a writeup of a device that lets you do this, called a panjagan.
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Old 08-12-2021, 09:16 AM   #8
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbone View Post
Dungeon Fantasy 11: Power-Ups has the Double-Shot ability, which draws and fires two arrows at once.

You specifically mention wanting to fire 3+ arrows, though, so maybe you're already using this? (If so... perhaps it can be adapted for use with 3+ arrows.)
Extend the penalties per arrow as far as the GM is willing to tolerate and redo the math on the power-up, which has two chunks:

1. Fast-Draw at -2 × (total number of arrows) to ready more than one arrow at a time: -4 for two arrows, -6 for three, -8 for four, and so on. This comes from Martial Arts, p. 103. The penalty is halved for either Heroic Archer or Weapon Master (Bow): -2 for two arrows, -3 for three, -4 for four, and so on. It's divided by 4 and rounded in the character's favor for both: -1 for two or three arrows, -2 for four or five, and so on. The associated Hard technique is nonstandard, and requires a Unique Technique perk and Heroic Archer. This leads to:
Prerequisite: Heroic Archer.

Unique Technique (Double-Draw) [1]

Either:
Double Draw (H) Fast-Draw+0 [3] for two arrows, [4] for three arrows, [5] for four arrows, and so on without Weapon Master
or:
Double Draw (H) Fast-Draw+0 [2] for two or three arrows, [3] for four or five arrows, and so on with Weapon Master
2. Bow at -4 per arrow after the first, on all attacks, to shoot more than one arrow at a time. This is normally limited to -4 for shooting two arrows at once; see Martial Arts, p. 83. The GM could allow -8 for three, -12 for four, or whatever suits the campaign. Heroic Archer halves the penalty: -2 for two arrows, -4 for three, -6 for four, and so on. The associated technique is Hard and requires Heroic Archer or Weapon Master (Bow). This leads to:
Prerequisite: Heroic Archer or Weapon Master (Bow).

Either:
Dual-Weapon Attack (H) Bow+0 [5] for two arrows, [9] for three arrows, [13] for four arrows, and so on without Heroic Archer
or:
Dual-Weapon Attack (H) Bow+0 [3] for two arrows, [5] for three arrows, [7] for four arrows, and so on with Heroic Archer
→→

The Double-Shot power-up assumes the character has Heroic Archer, might have Weapon Master, and is shooting two arrows:
Unique Technique (Double-Draw) [1]

Double Draw (H) Fast-Draw+0 [3] for two arrows, or [2] with Weapon Master

Dual-Weapon Attack (H) Bow+0 [3] for two arrows with Heroic Archer
That's 1+3+3 = 7 points without Weapon Master, or 1+2+3 = 6 points with Weapon Master.

→→→

Tri-Shot (like in the film) would assume the character has Heroic Archer, might have Weapon Master, and is shooting three arrows:
Unique Technique (Triple-Draw) [1]

Triple Draw (H) Fast-Draw+0 [4] for three arrows, or [2] with Weapon Master

Triple-Weapon Attack (H) Bow+0 [5] for three arrows
That's 1+4+5 = 10 points without Weapon Master, or 1+2+5 = 8 points with Weapon Master.

→→→→

Quad-Shot would be the sanest limiting case for human hands. It would assume the character has Heroic Archer, might have Weapon Master, and is shooting four arrows:
Unique Technique (Quadruple-Draw) [1]

Quadruple-Draw (H) Fast-Draw+0 [5] for four arrows, or [3] with Weapon Master

Quadruple-Weapon Attack (H) Bow+0 [7] for four arrows
That's 1+5+7 = 13 points without Weapon Master, or 1+3+7 = 11 points with Weapon Master.



I wouldn't back-calculate bonuses for using just two arrows with Tri-Shot or just three with Quad-Shot. Too bad, so sad. You're a machine gun, so stop complaining.

And as Double-Shot says, you get full range and damage, but need Enhanced Tracking to get Accuracy for more than one target. If it all seems too generous, requiring Enhanced Tracking 1 (Multiple Lock-Ons, +20%) [6] for Double-Shot (making the real cost 13/12 points), Enhanced Tracking 2 (Multiple Lock-Ons, +20%) [12] for Tri-Shot (making the real cost 22/20 points), or Enhanced Tracking 3 (Multiple Lock-Ons, +20%) [18] for Quad-Shot (making the real cost 31/29 points) seems like a completely justifiable control. It would also explain actually hitting several people.

If you decide to use this with quick-shooting, remember to apply its penalties, or slap on the Quick-Shot power-up for another 5 points (3 points with Weapon Master).
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Old 08-12-2021, 09:16 AM   #9
smin32
 
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
I don't know if GURPS Martial Arts has a Korean translation, but it seems like you should be able to adapt the rules for Combinations from there in this case. That basically lets you extend Dual Weapon Attack (combining it with Rapid Strike, but it should work here as well). Two attacks is at -4 (as normal), three attacks is at -9, four attacks is at -15, and from there on it's -6 per additional attack, as per normal Rapid Strike rules. This can be bought off as a Technique (with a small additional cost), although you typically are required to define where each attack is aimed when you create the Combination.

Personally, I'd be more inclined to just let you keep piling on arrows, at -4 to all attacks per arrow beyond the first (so -4 for two, -8 for three, -12 for four, and so forth), and just let you extend the Dual Weapon Attack Technique to cover however many arrows you're willing to pay for (if you've put [12] in it, you can shoot two arrows at +0 each, three at +0 each, four at -1 each, five at -5 each, and so forth). Realistically, more arrows should mean less damage per arrow, but that can be safely ignored in a cinematic campaign (although you may wish to require characters to have Heroic Archer and/or Weapon Master: Bow to be able to pull off such feats).
Thanks for the reply, Varyon.
Actually, I have discussed the solution you suggested with the master.
It deserves further discussion as it is not a rule set out in the official GURPS work, but I think this extension rule is reasonable.
In addition to checking the information provided by other respondents, we will discuss the method you suggested with the master once again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbone View Post
Dungeon Fantasy 11: Power-Ups has the Double-Shot ability, which draws and fires two arrows at once.

You specifically mention wanting to fire 3+ arrows, though, so maybe you're already using this? (If so... perhaps it can be adapted for use with 3+ arrows.)

Thanks for the reply, tbone.
Unfortunately, GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 11: Power-Ups is not translated from Korean. In Korea, under the name of GURPS Dungeon Fantasy, only the contents of volumes 1 to 4 of the English version are bundled into one book and published after translation.
Unfortunately, in Korea, GURPS is less popular than Call of Cthulhu RPG, so translation publications of GURPS works have almost stopped. So this is my first time reading GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 11: Power-Ups. I've never used Double-Shot either.
What I'm using is using the Quick-Shooting Bows rule of GURPS MA and the Dual-Weapon Attack (Bow) technique together to fire 2 arrows in one attack per turn.

Fortunately, while I was searching based on Taneli's answer earlier, I found the Double-Shot you mentioned. It was in English, so I needed a translation, but I checked the contents.
As far as I know, Double-Shot's description doesn't show how to fire 3 arrows at once, if you have any instructions on how to adjust it, could you please let me know? I'd appreciate it if you did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by whswhs View Post
GURPS Low-Tech, page 78, has a writeup of a device that lets you do this, called a panjagan.
Thanks for the reply, whswhs.
The Panjagan you suggested is a great weapon. But there is one problem. In a traditional Wuxia-themed world, the Panjagan is simply not the right weapon for Xia(GURPS MA p.8) to wield.

Xia is usually armed and martial-trained civilians. There is a limit to the level of technological development of weapons they can obtain, and even if they obtain high-performance weapons, wearing them publicly is highly likely to violate the laws of the background world.
In the case of the Panjagan, as you can see from its appearance, it was made as a weapon of war. It is not easy to obtain such equipment, and even if it is obtained, it is normal that an individual should not carry it around.
In particular, Xia, who is almost always opposed to the court, is accused of possessing such equipment as a criminal or, in extreme cases, a traitor, and is pursued by the military.

The Panjagan is also a sophisticated piece of equipment that requires some skill to maintain and maintain. Although the Xias are relatively well educated, they most likely lack the skills to maintain a Panjagan, even to their knowledge.

Finally, because Xias are always on the move, they prefer simple and light equipment, and tend to prefer long-lasting swords and easy-to-maintain bows rather than equipment designed to quickly burn out large amounts of ammunition like the Panjagan.
And best of all, using a Panjagan is hard to consider, as plain bows are more suited to creating Wuxia-style action. It's kind of like using a dual pistol in a modern-day cinematic campaign instead of an ICW with a powerful grenade launcher built in just because it's cooler.

Aside from the above, the Panjagan is a really useful weapon! If all else fails, I'll seriously consider introducing Panjagan to my character.
Thanks again for the good info, whswhs.

Last edited by smin32; 08-12-2021 at 09:21 AM.
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Old 08-12-2021, 09:31 AM   #10
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Default Re: Cinematic Archery: How to fire multiple arrows with a single shot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
Extend the penalties per arrow as far as the GM is willing to tolerate and redo the math on the power-up, which has two chunks:
Thanks for the reply, Kromm.
Since the amount of content you have written is considerable, it seems necessary to analyze the Korean supplements that I have, including the Korean version of the GURPS Basic set, by comparing them with the English supplements.

First of all, I briefly read the outline of your proposal through a translator, but I am sure it is good overall and will be very helpful.
It's a bit annoying that I have to create a few new skills (the Korean version of GURPS doesn't have instructions for GURPS Power-ups because GURPS Power-ups have not been officially released, so players rarely create new skills on their own) I think it's well worth a serious suggestion to the Master.

I especially liked the part where the penalty overlaps as the number of arrows you want to fire increases. This reminds me of the Multiple Fast-Draw rule, which feels as interesting and practical as a variant of the Rapid Strike rule proposed by Varyon earlier.

Based on your suggestion, let's do a little more research on how various abilities work, including Double-Shot in GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 11: Power-ups. It's sure to be a fun time!

Once again, thank you for your sincere reply.
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