When reality and roleplaying get in a fist fight

[Kizara]

Originally Posted by Sense of Duty (Kittens)

Why is this? Theorhetically, the rotation gives you more time to acccelerate.

It's too telegraphed, too slow, and leaves you too open.

[Kromm]

Originally Posted by Sense of Duty (Kittens)

Why is this, theorhetically, the rotation gives you more time to acccelerate.

Because it's highly telegraphic, and during that extra time to accelerate, your enemy doesn't have to stand there and wait. In GURPS, this is simulated by the fact that Spinning Kick (1) is always a Committed or All-Out Attack that hoses your active defenses, (2) involves a Quick Contest that could actually give your target a bonus to defend, which he could parlay into a Riposte, and (3) gives you an extra -2 on the roll to avoid falling if you screw up. As a general rule, it's suicidal against anybody who isn't a lot worse than you, because the most likely result against a skilled fighter is that you fall down and get stomped whilst defenseless.

In a real fight, you usually want to use short, snapping kicks or kicks/knees that come in close, under the victim's line of sight. They don't warn him as much, and don't put you in a situation where he can just sweep you or step aside and watch you fall over. In game terms, these would often be kicks thrown as Defensive Attack maneuvers, usually with the Deceptive Attack option.

[JackGiantkiller]

High kicks in general are just easy to block or dodge, and the number of times I've seen legs caught is just ridiculous. Learn to punch, and kick people no higher than the groin.

[PK]

Just to demonstrate the versatility of GURPS, though, do note that if you're playing in a cinematic game and have decided that action movies are the rule of the day, GURPS Martial Arts has all of the behind-the-scenes info on how (e.g.) Spinning Kick would have been built, so it's simple for a GM to remove any or all of the restrictions, making it into "a kick, but way better".

Of course, in doing so, you increase the skill penalty to something ridiculously low -- but that's why action movie martial artists all have Karate-25 or higher, right?

[The_Nightwatch]

When players and GMs disagree on what's realistic, in my experience it's too often been a case of incompatibility. For example, I played briefly in a campaign set at TL9, where you could bypass all the defenses in the enemy headquarters by going through the air ducts. I was amazed. This culture had made it to TL9 without seeing all the TL7 TV shows that pulled the same stunt? I realized pretty quickly that my playing style didn't fit, and got out.

With luck the players work things out when designing the character. "I want to be able to dodge bullets like in The Matrix." Well, okay, I run a campaign where that's possible, although expensive. But better to have the discussion at this stage than four games into the campaign when they try it in a fight. And if whatever they want isn't possible in the campaign, that should be settled as soon as possible. I had a player once who I realized too late wanted the limelight for roleplaying, but had no interest in combat, etc., and wanted a character who was essentially immune to everything. Wish I'd realized that sooner, it didn't end very happily.

So GMs and players need to try to make sure right at the start they're in the same book, preferably same chapter, optimally same page!!

[Flyndaran]

The only examples of real world and GM's gaming style got in a fight was when he actually expected our under level 10 characters to charge right into a fight with an aged dragon.
For some unknown reason he was surprised when the "face" character aced her diplomacy rolls and pushed for a "we are useful to you so don't eat us without considering our offer." like any sane creature would when faced with such a intelligent monster.

[BMR]

You can also deliver plenty of damage with a straight thrust in the "real world", and a kick that reaches the pelvis or thighs can bring someone down without the need for targeting their head or their knees. When you go for that center of gravity and motion, an opposing strike can bend them over like a jackknife, or drop them straight on their tailbone. Then you can play with their heads, because it will be level with your own waist.

Keeping punches at arm level and kicks at leg level is an old wisdom of martial arts (or at least it is around my parts). It delivers the closest limb to the target fastest, and reduces (but does not eliminate) telegraphing by your eyes.

That said, in my hey-dey I could get a good side thrust, round-house, or front to the sternum or ribs pretty easily. And my legs are still strong enough and fast enough that it is dangerous to try and block or grab my foot (sweeping or side-stepping is another matter). Some styles and schools emphasize the ability to deliver kicks above the waist. But the important thing is to keep yourself facing the target with the most direct line blow you can achieve into the area of least defense.

There are reasons why GURPS has penalties to kicking, and those for spinning kicks and the like are well earned. I have faced brown and black belts who could do turn-around back kicks and other cyclic blows, very fast and very unexpectedly. But they kept these moves in reserve, after practicing them for many years. And when you spar enough, you start to learn the little bits of body posture that heralds such an attack.