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Old 11-28-2010, 08:37 PM   #11
sir_pudding
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty View Post
For extremely high and low SMs, yes, that's true. But that's because there are no "realistic" SM +3 and SM -4 humanoids.

In other words, since the rules are being written for giants and pixies who themselves violate the square-cube law, it would be rather silly to require that the weapons for those giants and pixies follow the square-cube law!
Sure and that makes sense.
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:09 AM   #12
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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Originally Posted by Stripe View Post

From the FAQ:

3. Work out the Basic Lift (BL) for this minimum ST.

4. Since ST corresponds to height, ST^2 corresponds to area. Because BL is simply a multiple of ST^2, you can scale armor -- which covers your area -- with BL. Simply multiply armor cost and weight by BL/20, where "BL" is the BL for the minimum ST above and 20 is human-average BL.

Example: An SM +1 creature is on average 9' tall; that is, three yards tall. Minimum ST for that height is 5 x 3 = 15. BL for ST 15 is 45, so armor cost and weight scale by a factor of 45/20 = 2.25. A $500, 18-lb. breastplate becomes $1,125 and 40.5 lbs.
Hmmm. I wonder how well this works as an optional rule for armors in general? For examle, the weight of any given armor for a character's ST for say, ST 12, ST 15, ST 20, etc?

Something to experiment with later one to be sure ;)
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Old 11-29-2010, 03:22 PM   #13
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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Anyway, such rules are needed. The same questions arise each week in these forums.
No freaking kidding.
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:16 PM   #14
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

"In other words, since the rules are being written for giants and pixies who themselves violate the square-cube law, it would be rather silly to require that the weapons for those giants and pixies follow the square-cube law!"

Whats the square-cube law? and where do you guys come up with these formulas? (second is not a serious question unless you would like to share.)
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:23 PM   #15
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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Originally Posted by zylosan View Post
"In other words, since the rules are being written for giants and pixies who themselves violate the square-cube law, it would be rather silly to require that the weapons for those giants and pixies follow the square-cube law!"

Whats the square-cube law? and where do you guys come up with these formulas? (second is not a serious question unless you would like to share.)
When an object undergoes a proportional increase in size, its new volume is proportional to the cube of the multiplier and its new surface area is proportional to the square of the multiplier.

Basically, things get heavier much faster then they get larger.

edit: so your 200 lb, 6' tall man turned into a 12' giant is now 1600 lbs. and requires 4x the weight of armor to cover him.
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Last edited by StormCrow42; 11-29-2010 at 10:29 PM. Reason: Added example
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

The square cube law is a feature of reality. When you multiply dimensions by by X, you multiply area by X^2, and volume by X^3.
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Old 11-29-2010, 10:26 PM   #17
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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Originally Posted by zylosan View Post
"In other words, since the rules are being written for giants and pixies who themselves violate the square-cube law, it would be rather silly to require that the weapons for those giants and pixies follow the square-cube law!"

Whats the square-cube law? and where do you guys come up with these formulas? (second is not a serious question unless you would like to share.)
If you make a structure (or creature) larger by some factor, keeping its proportions the same, then its area, and things that depend on area, such as strength, increase by the factor squared. Meanwhile, its volume and weight will increase by the factor cubed.

That is, if you make a cockroach the size of a person (100 times larger), its strength will increase by a factor of 10,000 (100 squared) but its weight will increase by a factor of 1,000,000 (100 cubed). It will most likely collapse under its weight, as its relatively puny muscles and exoskeleton will no longer be up to the task.

Where do they come up with their formulae if not from the square-cube law? Probably out of their... um... finely honed sense of playability and genre-appropriateness. ;)

TeV
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Old 11-30-2010, 12:03 AM   #18
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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Originally Posted by teviet View Post
If you make a structure (or creature) larger by some factor, keeping its proportions the same, then its area, and things that depend on area, such as strength, increase by the factor squared...
Let me add that in this case "strength" is a real-world term, not a game term. GURPS 4e already incorporates this by scaling load capacity to the square of the linear ST stat (a big improvement over 3e). The reason ST scales as area is because it depends on the cross-section, not the volume, of the muscle.

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Old 05-18-2013, 12:56 AM   #19
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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The reason ST scales as area is because it depends on the cross-section, not the volume, of the muscle.
Which causes all sorts of math issues. For the longest time I thought strength went up at the same rate as weight. Now I have no idea how to make a realistic SM+3 giant. At a certain point, the human form apparently becomes unusable. Same going down.
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Old 05-18-2013, 12:59 AM   #20
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Default Re: Armor Cost and Weight for 1+ SM

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Originally Posted by kirbwarrior View Post
Which causes all sorts of math issues. For the longest time I thought strength went up at the same rate as weight. Now I have no idea how to make a realistic SM+3 giant. At a certain point, the human form apparently becomes unusable. Same going down.
Necromancy FTW. There's no such thing as a realistic SM+3 giant humanoid (at least if made of conventional flesh, blood, and bone, and living on a 1G world), so you just have to decide how to make it unrealistic.
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