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Old 12-06-2020, 09:31 AM   #1
Plane
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Default closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcraft?

Until seeing this it never really hit home to me just how much of the in-game unit size is due to mechanical enhancements, it's a lot more like the Rifts Glitter Boy than it is to just a suit of Dead Boy armor, in terms of limb extension and size increase, basically...

Kind of wondering if there are any examples in one of the supplements that come close to this kind of PA and if the take the "vehicle as ally" or "vehicle as gadget advantages" approach to doing it.

Trying to think of realistic bare-bones minimums you would have for the HP and DR of such things. What you would expect as the lower threshold of what metal exoskeleta like these would provide. Is this the type of thing done in games like Warhammer?

This just makes me realize how absurd it is for Starcraft to treat these units as entirely organic when the majority of their durability surely must be mechanics. Maybe not to the same degree as a Siege Tank or SCV but still at least 50% mechanics not biologics.

I guess a similar criticism could be made of Warcraft, some of that HP has gotta be "armor" repairable via peasants as a Transport is (weirdly not Ballistas... I guess it takes more skill to build a balista than a transport) rather than helped w/ healing touch of a Paladin.

I suppose unless you use "Damage to Armor" rules in Low-Tech GURPS operates in a simialr way though because in these games they have 'armor' stats equivalent to the "never goes away DR" that armor provides under Basic Set rules. But since GURPS does have such tools it allows for more realistic thinking about iconic things of these old RTS games.
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Old 12-06-2020, 10:20 AM   #2
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

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Originally Posted by Plane View Post
U

Kind of wondering if there are any examples in one of the supplements that come close to this kind of PA
The closest thing in 4e materials would be the TL9 Combat Walkers in UT which would probably be fairly close to Battletech Clan Elemental aremor if illustrated. They are definitely larger than man-sized and "climbed into" rather than "worn".

Being in UT they are simply gear bought with money.
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Old 12-06-2020, 11:28 AM   #3
AlexanderHowl
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

Being TL9, they are technically capable of being mass produced in a realistic TL8 society, though it would involve the difficulties involved in realistic invention and mass production (and finding a military that wants to pay nearly a $1 million each for them). In a TL10+ setting though, they have largely been replaced by heavy battlesuits (a TL10 version of a combat walker should probably increase the bonuses and DR given by 50%, while keeping the same price). In any case, +30 Lifting, +30 Striking ST, and DR 300/180 may only be worth the intimidation factor, as TL 10 weapons can punch through armor rather easily.
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Old 12-06-2020, 12:24 PM   #4
RedMattis
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

Starcraft, especially the first one could basically be described as hillbillies in space. Iirc. the Terrans there are basically rejects sent far far far away to colonize.

Given that the marines are probably genetically modified giants and they inject themselves with almost lethal drugs (stimpack) I'd guess that their power armor requires exceptional strength to properly use.

I'd put Starcraft in the 'Space Fantasy' category where they are basically operating at TL8^ or TL9^ with bits and pieces of higher tech-levels (AI, FTL, ...). Heck, you might even declare that much of Terrain tech basically operates by the power of WH40K-orc-style "WAAAGH!", and it would probably feel perfectly fine. Might explain why marines seem to have been bred to be dumber than a box of rocks too. Don't ask questions about how your stuff works, just take the drugs and shoot.
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Old 12-06-2020, 01:30 PM   #5
Anthony
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

The idea that Starcraft is a ripoff of WH40 and Warcraft is a ripoff of Warhammer is... probably accurate.

The problem with hulking battle suits is that the articulation really doesn't work; try to bend the arms/legs of one of those hulking suits and you dislocate or break your limbs. Either it has to be basically the same size as the wearer, or it has to be big enough that the wearer fits entirely within the torso.
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Old 12-06-2020, 02:25 PM   #6
AlexanderHowl
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

In a SM+2 suit, you could function through having the leg controls in the upper legs and the arm controls in the upper arms, though there may be difficulties with fine control.
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Old 12-06-2020, 03:04 PM   #7
Rolando
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

Starcraft ripoffed Starship Trooper, not WH40k. I think it deserve some respect :)

Big battlesuits don't dislocate people limbs, limbs usually extend to the shoulders and the hips, or something... it depends on the design. It is a matter of designer choice, it is not real engineering or science, just decide how it work and it will work like that.

you just have to look for it
https://starcraft.fandom.com/wiki/CM...ed_Combat_Suit

There you get all the specs you need for a conversion, the rest is handwave and game design choice (put as much armor to stop the weapons you want it to stop, etc).

With weight you can get hit points too.

You can also get GURPS Mecha (3ed) and make it more "accurately", the translation from 3ed to 4ed for that type of equipment is not big, you can use 3ed mecha straight from the book in 4ed games.
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Old 12-06-2020, 07:06 PM   #8
Anthony
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

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Originally Posted by Rolando View Post
Big battlesuits don't dislocate people limbs, limbs usually extend to the shoulders and the hips, or something... it depends on the design.
Try actually overlaying a human image over one of those giant suits.
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Old 12-06-2020, 07:29 PM   #9
Rolando
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
Try actually overlaying a human image over one of those giant suits.
I'm sure you can find a few arts showing exactly the pilot body, head, arms and legs are when using the suit.

Some designers have the arms in the chest, somewhat like driving a byke, some in the shoulders, some crossed over the chest (using direct neural control)... for the starcraft ones I think it in the shoulders and the legs fit in the legs, the soldier knees don't get too far from the suit knees so they can bend just fine, but I'm not really a fan of the setting.

If you see the multiple arts in the wiki page I linked you will see that some of the arts are not as disproportionately large and not all suits accommodate the soldier in the same way.

Edit:
IIRC, those suits are connected to the soldier spine, so the arms and legs just need a bit of space, the arms may be crossed over the chest. the legs extend well enough to flex at the hips and knees due to the design of the suit.
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Old 12-06-2020, 07:36 PM   #10
Rolando
 
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Default Re: closest Space/Ultratech equiv to the giant power armors used by Marines in Starcr

This animation, on the other hand, makes them a lot smaller.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaXs...hannel=IulianG
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