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Old 09-14-2022, 06:02 AM   #1
briansommers
 
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Default Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

Noob here.

Iĺm I to understand correctly that armor on spaceships is solid and not a layer added to the outside?

So, thereĺs front, center, rear hull areas each consisting of 6 areas each?

So when I add armor to any of the 18 sections of the hull, I canĺt put anything else in there correct?
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Old 09-14-2022, 06:26 AM   #2
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

The spaceships system is one that calculates mass not volume.

There are a total of 20 systems.
6 front, 6 center, 6 rear and 2 core systems

If you put in armor that takes one of the 20 slots as armor has significant mass thus each such mass unit takes one of the mass slots and provides the armor value given in the table into that section.
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Last edited by weby; 09-14-2022 at 03:30 PM. Reason: bug in the listing of module counts
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Old 09-14-2022, 07:31 AM   #3
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

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Originally Posted by weby View Post
There are a total of 20 systems.
6 front, 6 center, 2 rear and 2 core systems
Pretty sure this is a "changed my thought halfway through"; it's 6 rear, not 2.

But yes, an armor module - like all modules - takes up 5% of the ship's overall mass.
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Old 09-14-2022, 07:34 AM   #4
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

I'm guessing there are no Washington Treaty style shenanigans then with using the ship's bulk water tanks as armour or what have you...
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Old 09-14-2022, 08:38 AM   #5
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

As noted, each system is 5% of the mass of the ship, so if you assign one as armor, said armor has a mass equal to 5% that of the ship, and you only have 95% to work with for the rest of it. Said armor systems are spread over that section of hull, however - that dDR protects everything (except for Exposed Systems, naturally) in the same section where it is set.

Armor is incredibly dense, however, so there are some optional rules in Pyramid #3/34 to account for this - having a lot of armor makes your vessel smaller, which increases the effectiveness of armor (less surface area to cover means thicker armor for a given mass), and can even make your vessel harder to hit (-1 or -2 to SM, due to being rather small compared to less-armored vessels of the same mass). Personally, I also don't see a serious issue with allowing armor to be added on in excess of the 20-system limit, but if you do so you'll need to adjust acceleration and delta-v. For example, let's say you've got a ship - 2G acceleration, 9 fuel tanks, total delta-v 31.5 mps - where all the systems are already taken up, but you decide to toss on another 3 armor modules (one for each section) to increase dDR. Your ship is now 115% - 23/20 - of the mass that its drives were designed for. You would divide acceleration by this ratio, giving you around 87% of your originally-calculated acceleration - around 1.7G. For delta-v, you would actually divide your number of fuel tanks by this ratio, then recalculate delta-v from there. 9 fuel tanks becomes 7.8 fuel tanks, which works out to only 23.4 mps delta-v (9 fuel tanks has a multiplier of x1.4, but 7-8 fuel tanks only has a multiplier of x1.2, hence the loss of more than 13% of your delta-v).

Making a vessel extremely heavy by piling on armor should make it harder to handle, as your Control Room (or, rather, the attitude gyros/thrusters/etc that actually make up the bulk of the Control Room's mass) is too small. -1 to Hnd if you're 150% mass (10 extra armor systems) or larger; at 300% mass (40 extra armor systems), you should just redesign the vessel to be one SM larger, but with enough armor to be targeted as a smaller vessel.

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I'm guessing there are no Washington Treaty style shenanigans then with using the ship's bulk water tanks as armour or what have you...
I don't think there are any rules for doing so, no. Spaceships doesn't directly track the weight of water (presumably, it's included in the mass of any system that provides life support), but you could probably work something out (I believe water canonically grants around DR 1 per inch).
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Old 09-14-2022, 08:52 AM   #6
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colonel View Post
I'm guessing there are no Washington Treaty style shenanigans then with using the ship's bulk water tanks as armour or what have you...
That's Radiation PF rather than DR. You cna have Ice armor I think.
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:18 AM   #7
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

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Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
I don't think there are any rules for doing so, no. Spaceships doesn't directly track the weight of water (presumably, it's included in the mass of any system that provides life support), but you could probably work something out (I believe water canonically grants around DR 1 per inch).
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That's Radiation PF rather than DR. You cna have Ice armor I think.
I would imagine that a water tank should also meddle with directed energy beams as well - 1DR/inch sounds fine for kinetic hits, but I have no notion what it would do to laser, plasma or charged particle beams...
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:57 AM   #8
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

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Originally Posted by The Colonel View Post
I would imagine that a water tank should also meddle with directed energy beams as well - 1DR/inch sounds fine for kinetic hits, but I have no notion what it would do to laser, plasma or charged particle beams...
I'd treat it the same, but note that the armor divisors (if any - I don't think plasma weapons have such) of those weapons would still be in play. It might be appropriate to adjust this based on the wavelength of the light (I believe blue-green lasers go through water a bit more readily, while IR, red, and UV have more issues, but I'm not sure that actually has an impact at the energy level a weaponized laser would work at). GURPS handling of particle beam performance against armor isn't quite realistic (armor should function more like PF against such, from what I understand), but it's probably good enough. Again, I'd just treat water as though it were any other source of DR, or maybe give it a level of Hardened.
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:58 AM   #9
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colonel View Post
I would imagine that a water tank should also meddle with directed energy beams as well - 1DR/inch sounds fine for kinetic hits, but I have no notion what it would do to laser, plasma or charged particle beams...
An entire module of water tank would absorb damage like any other module as it was damaged or destroyed. That's techncially HP rather than even ablative DR even though those two things are very close.

Also, you really, really can not figure anything per inch (directly) in Spaceships. It's a mass-based system that's completely agnostic on volume or even linear measurements. If you chose steel Armor and got a dDR of 7 you would know that your hull armor was 25mm thick over the hull section in question but that's about the limit
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Old 09-14-2022, 11:30 AM   #10
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Default Re: Spaceships hull armorůsolid?

I'd use the Fuel Tank modules to represent tanks of water, personally. With some reaction mass drives, that might even be the case. YMMV, though.
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