[DtG] New GURPS Players, $150 Each.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by DaosusLeghki

I'll pick it up later
This is a tempting thing to do. Why pick up product you don't need right now? I'd like to propose a couple of reasons you might want to back the Kickstarter now. First, physical copies will be gone relatively quickly. I don't have any insight into Doug's business plan beyond what he's shared publicly, but I highly doubt he is going to print many excess copies of the book. So, if you want to pick this up in a year from now, it will probably not be there. Second, backing the Kickstarter sends Gaming Ballistic a signal that there is interest. These days, almost all sales happen within the first few months of a product's release. If you want to pick this product up later, back the Kickstarter now instead, and let Doug know he should continue making product like this.

Hmmm... these are good points. For someone who doesn't have any DFRPG, how compatible is Delvers to Grow (and the higher-tier rewards, like Fantastic Dungeon Grappling) with GURPS DF? Is it something where I could just seamlessly use DtG in a GURPS DF campaign, or would some degree of conversion be necessary?

[Kalzazz]

I don't see any real issue with it, you will end up with characters that seem conceptually similar to DF on the Cheap

[peruses]

I've been using Gaming Ballistic's Nordlond products and FDG with full GURPS rules for a year now, it blends seamlessly, very few rules are actually different and you have to watch what advantages and disads you let in like any GURPS campaign. everything in DFRPG is built with GURPS rules then they hide all the excess (for DF) complexity.

[Anders]

Originally Posted by Varyon

Hmmm... these are good points. For someone who doesn't have any DFRPG, how compatible is Delvers to Grow (and the higher-tier rewards, like Fantastic Dungeon Grappling) with GURPS DF? Is it something where I could just seamlessly use DtG in a GURPS DF campaign, or would some degree of conversion be necessary?

It is completely seamless for the basic templates. If you want to make an Incanter or a Scholar you need to invent new modules, but you have a large number of worked examples to help you.

[peruses]

In fact one of my newer players who has been a joy for the past month or so built his PC using mostly DtG in it's very early beta/playtest release and I would have never known if it hadn't come up in chat later.

[Kalzazz]

The Wrestler is also covered

[DouglasCole]

Originally Posted by Varyon

Hmmm... these are good points. For someone who doesn't have any DFRPG, how compatible is Delvers to Grow (and the higher-tier rewards, like Fantastic Dungeon Grappling) with GURPS DF? Is it something where I could just seamlessly use DtG in a GURPS DF campaign, or would some degree of conversion be necessary?

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

I don't see any real issue with it, you will end up with characters that seem conceptually similar to DF on the Cheap

That's substantially correct. There are a few things that will be different, but those reflect the differences as published between (say) the wording of X spell or advantage in GURPS vs the honed presentation in the Dungeon Fantasy RPG.

But for those whose goal is to provide a "core competency" of "combat capable delver" you're going to get there in five to ten minutes. If you want (say) a 150-point delver that leverages the backgrounds and social abilities that are present more strongly in the Dungeon Fantasy+Basic Set worked genre example, you might take the 125-point delving-focused template and then say "spend 25 points on other stuff minimum, and if you really want to go to town on social and non-delving things, take the points from your upgrade module and make them social points instead."

So you'd get a core competency, and then 25 or 50 points of "other stuff." And you'd get there in 5-15 minutes, even for a beginning player. Then tweak as much as you'd like.

FDG plus this post by The Chaotic GM is as close to "Technical Grappling, 2nd edition and way smoother at the table" as you're going to find. The combo covers just about everything except some of the fiddle with "impaling and control points" and kills dead a few things like Grip CP that were just a terrible idea. That and recalculating strength every darned grapple.

[Varyon]

Consider me sold, then, in no small part because Kreios' writeup of his Wrestler made it clear that this is GURPS, just with a different structural approach to character building (by all appearances, I could easily just grab his Wrestler and toss him into another campaign without needing to make any adjustments, mechanically). I still have to make a call as to tier... leaning toward Nordlond Explorer. And of course I'm torn on if I want digital only (which is my typical leaning) or if I want the physical copies as well (which would be incredibly useful for pickup games and the like)...

[DouglasCole]

Originally Posted by Varyon

Consider me sold, then, in no small part because Kreios' writeup of his Wrestler made it clear that this is GURPS, just with a different structural approach to character building (by all appearances, I could easily just grab his Wrestler and toss him into another campaign without needing to make any adjustments, mechanically). I still have to make a call as to tier... leaning toward Nordlond Explorer. And of course I'm torn on if I want digital only (which is my typical leaning) or if I want the physical copies as well (which would be incredibly useful for pickup games and the like)...

So, I want to hit a few points:

1. YES. You have nailed the core concept here entirely. This IS [the Dungeon Fantasy RPG], which is Powered by GURPS, which is a separate product line but let's face it: The pulsing heart of the GURPS engine is right there for all to see.

2. YES. This is a structurally different way - a FASTER way - to approach character generation. While it's most useful for beginners, advanced players will find it useful to get "in the basket" of close to final, after which you can tweak.

The thing about this that you will likely never see is how much bloody work Kevin put into every single module. He really studied, ripped apart, and put back together every single professional template (plus the Wrestler) in the Dungeon Fantasy RPG in order to get to the mandatory core, strip out "trap" options in both character, spells, and loadouts, and generally make it so that you are guaranteed to have a paper person who is competent, covers their niche, and ready-to-play.

It's a masterwork of character design facilitation...while still keeping the player in the driver's seat.

[peruses]

Originally Posted by Varyon

Consider me sold, then, in no small part because Kreios' writeup of his Wrestler made it clear that this is GURPS, just with a different structural approach to character building (by all appearances, I could easily just grab his Wrestler and toss him into another campaign without needing to make any adjustments, mechanically). I still have to make a call as to tier... leaning toward Nordlond Explorer. And of course I'm torn on if I want digital only (which is my typical leaning) or if I want the physical copies as well (which would be incredibly useful for pickup games and the like)...

All of the GB books are very visually appealing which also helps in recruiting new players at the FLGS.