Cost of Living Breakdown

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Why would it matter how much it costs? Maybe you privitised it from the government. Maybe you live in the apartment by registration without having privitised it.

I'm pretty sure that's only a thing in the former Soviet bloc.

Maybe you inherited it from you [grand]parents. Maybe you had it given as a present instead of a car for graduation. Maybe you worked hard, lived at negative status, and saved up money. It's not like people don't do those sorts of things.

People in this part of the world don't generally own single apartment units (they do own condos, though).

[Langy]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Why rental? It says you have an appartment, not rent one. So your housing would only include utility bills and the occasional maintenance expense.

Because you generally don't own apartments. A unit in a multi-family building where you can own a single unit is called a 'condo'; apartment is the term for a rental property.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Langy

Because you generally don't own apartments. A unit in a multi-family building where you can own a single unit is called a 'condo'; apartment is the term for a rental property.

This is confusing. Google seems to think that apartment == 'a suite of rooms forming one residence, typically in a building containing a number of these', and seems to make it equal to квартира or flat. Wiki also says that an apartment can be owned by the person(s) occupying it, or rented by them; and again, that some apartment-dwellers own them, but others don't. Judging by all that, seems like these aren't exactly precise terms.

Hmm. GURPS is generic and all that.

[Langy]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

This is confusing. Google seems to think that apartment == 'a suite of rooms forming one residence, typically in a building containing a number of these', and seems to make it equal to квартира or flat. Wiki also says that an apartment can be owned by the person(s) occupying it, or rented by them; and again, that some apartment-dwellers own them, but others don't. Judging by all that, seems like these aren't exactly precise terms.

Hmm. GURPS is generic and all that.

In the US, the proper term for an apartment unit that is owned is a 'condominium'. If they intended that it was owned, they'd have used 'condo' instead of 'apartment'. Condo owners are typically higher-status than apartment-renters, too.

Note also that apartment rental prices are approximately equal to mortgage payment prices for a house; it would make no sense for cost of living to not include apartment rental costs but to include mortgage payments. Also, condos usually cost about the same to own as a house, so it again wouldn't make sense for the apartment to be 'free' and owned while the house is heavily mortgaged.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Langy

In the US, the proper term for an apartment unit that is owned is a 'condominium'. If they intended that it was owned, they'd have used 'condo' instead of 'apartment'. Condo owners are typically higher-status than apartment-renters, too.

Note also that apartment rental prices are approximately equal to mortgage payment prices for a house; it would make no sense for cost of living to not include apartment rental costs but to include mortgage payments. Also, condos usually cost about the same to own as a house, so it again wouldn't make sense for the apartment to be 'free' and owned while the house is heavily mortgaged.

Well, Status -1 gives you a (used) car. It doesn't particularly make sense to own a (normal) car but not own a place to live. You don't get to live in your car in reasonable comfort in case financial hard times strike you, you know.

Also, GURPS is not limited to USA, that's what I meant about Generic.

[Dammann]

It is possible, but atypical, in the US to own a single apartment. Most apartments are rented, and most home owners own either a house or a condo, which is a lot like an apartment but usually has an exterior entrance, rather than an entrance from a hallway, although there are exceptions (of course).

I have never heard of anyone "privatizing" any government property in this country, but the idea appeals to me. I am envisioning just squatting in the Post Office until it is somehow mine.

[Langy]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

Well, Status -1 gives you a (used) car. It doesn't particularly make sense to own a (normal) car but not own a place to live. You don't get to live in your car in reasonable comfort in case financial hard times strike you, you know.

Also, GURPS is not limited to USA, that's what I meant about Generic.

True, but it's written in US English. You have to read it as if it were written by Americans. It isn't written from the perspective of 'some generic Earthman'.

Also, it is completely normal to own a car but not a place to live in the US. The vast majority of people do so at one point in their lives (and the vast majority of people don't own their homes, either).

EDIT: Dammann, a single apartment that is owned apart from the building that it is in is the definition of a condo.

[Hans Rancke-Madsen]

For generic societies I use 1/3 food, 1/3 lodgings, 1/3 other expenses. For real life societies I use real life figures if I have ready access to the numbers; otherwise I use the same breakdown as for generic societies.

At one point I was working on something more differentiated as to social class and operated with five categories of expenses: food, lodging, other necessities, comforts, and luxuries. Never did finish it, though.


Hans

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by vicky_molokh

So yeah, seems to default to having a car. OTOH, it seems to default to also having an apartment, which means that the OP's estimate of 50% CoL on housing is too high - that's $300 worth in electricity, water, gas and heating for a single person. Also note that this value is also unlikely to grow as fast with increasing Status as the rest of CoL - spending something like $1,500 on that sort of stuff at Status 2 seems like a silly waste (now, a housekeeper is a nice thing to spend money on as far as Status 2 goes).

$300 sounds incredibly cheap to me. Half my monthly rent is $450, and utilities are on top of that. And that's in a shared apartment.

But this is very history-dependent. A lot of estimates I've seen suggest that in preindustrial societies, around 75% of economic output from a typical family goes to food.

Bill Stoddard

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by whswhs

But this is very history-dependent. A lot of estimates I've seen suggest that in preindustrial societies, around 75% of economic output from a typical family goes to food.

Though that includes dependents, and is probably crediting time spent on food preparation to the cost of food (which is legitimate in economic terms, but may be confusing in an RPG). It's also going to depend on the age and gender makeup of the family, a young couple with no children will be quite a bit less than that.