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Old 09-28-2016, 10:42 PM   #21
Flyndaran
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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Originally Posted by Ghostdancer View Post
Not on target for the thread, please don't derail this one, Flyndaran. Start another one.
If someone's going to create a write up that involves costs fatigue, I don't see why talking about it is off topic. But whatever.
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Old 09-28-2016, 11:02 PM   #22
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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No normal sized human could breathe fast enough 24/7 to oxidize 12k Calories worth of food a day. Just imagine breathing five times as fast as you do normally but constantly.
In high school I worked out 3-5 hours per day and ate 6000 kcal per day. And that level left me athletic but nearly without body fat. I'm sure actual athletes ingest and burn even more each day. So i think your assumption was flawed.
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Old 09-28-2016, 11:11 PM   #23
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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Originally Posted by DemiBenson View Post
In high school I worked out 3-5 hours per day and ate 6000 kcal per day. And that level left me athletic but nearly without body fat. I'm sure actual athletes ingest and burn even more each day. So i think your assumption was flawed.
Yeah, right now I need about 3kcal per day or I become extremely weak and disoriented. In high school I needed about the same amount. Also when I was unloading/loading trucks and doing asset protection/bodyguard work. I may be big, but I have a very high metabolism.
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Old 09-29-2016, 01:57 AM   #24
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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Originally Posted by Ghostdancer View Post
Not on target for the thread, please don't derail this one, Flyndaran. Start another one.
If we're verging into FP-cost builds anyway, it seems like an on-target comment aimed at your post.

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Recycling material almost certainly involves some scary waste products - diseases like malaria and ebola rapidly dismantle cells, which produces a lot of chemical byproducts. Doing it quickly overwhelms the liver and kidneys (which both diseases make worse by directly attacking of course, but we'll assume the magic regeneration thingies have the sense not to do).

So you'd probably have a requisite of a boosted liver and kidneys if you want to go this route.
Hmm. Regeneration of hit points in exchange for a buildup of toxins in the blood seems like an interesting mechanism. That being said, a boosted liver is right behind the corner for our inventor, and kidneys are not far behind. Talk about incentives.

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You also need to reclaim fluids that have been leaked into places they shouldn't go. That can be tricky, you'll be fighting the bodies natural inclination to swelling. There's also the cell-filled fluids and tissues that are flat out not in your body any more so there's limitations.
This doesn't sound as bad. At a minimum, extra drinking for replacing lost fluids (e.g. blood loss) is seemingly much easier than consuming as much food. But getting rid of extraneous fluids where they're harmful - I'm not sure how exactly that should be done; I'm inclined to believe this will be one of the major contributors for shifting one step closer to Unusual Biochemistry, but not all the way.

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Faster than the digestive tract can help with if you're hoping to get it by eating after the injury, I suspect.
Ultimately recommending an IV drip is definitely in the alpha-version description of the biomod.

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If you're not storing it as fat, then you must be storing it as sugars, which is pretty unheard of for mammals (tetrapods in general I think) but I don't see why you couldn't do it in genetic engineering or with nanites or with a sugar-water fuel tank or whatever. But you need more than just energy - you need all the nutrients, because that's what people are made of and you'll need to rebuild things.
I don't recall the precise numbers, but IIRC ('normal') sugars don't provide an enormous storage efficiency advantage, so might need to think of something else. Quick wiki check gives sugars 17MJ/kg, while fats get 37.

Even ethanol has only 26. Though a hacked metabolism that can safely handle lots of alcohol and use its energy to fuel ATP production would be amusing.

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If it's "only" a hole poked in you or a cut, then you need to build the scaffolding for new tissue, new tissue, and new blood volume (where's the water coming from?). We'll handwave how the nanites align your tissues correctly and keep them that way while healing without you being strapped in place.

If you've had major tissue damage (fire, chemical burns, the kinds of trauma that takes flesh right off you even if it's not a GURPS amputation that you need Regrowth for) then you need to magic that material out of somewhere. And the logical place for that is your other bones and muscles.

The most obvious way to store the reserves is extra-heavy bones and excess "unsupported" muscle mass that is dismantled by the nanites and relocated to where it's needed.
Hmm. Needing to consider the difference between cutting/impaling and destroying damage types seems like a bit complicated for the game I'm running. But the fact that the former can be modest in requirements is a plus.

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I played around a bit with the ideas here and my own, and got this:
Looks good as an alpha-version of the biomod.
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Old 09-29-2016, 02:05 AM   #25
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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If we're verging into FP-cost builds anyway, it seems like an on-target comment aimed at your post.
You're the OP. I just didn't want it derailed with "This sucks! Change it!" which Costs Fatigue seems to always devolve into.
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Old 09-29-2016, 02:20 AM   #26
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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You're the OP. I just didn't want it derailed with "This sucks! Change it!" which Costs Fatigue seems to always devolve into.
*shrug*
You're the first one to bring up the FP cost build (in reply to the LFP ideas), not Patrick.
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:19 AM   #27
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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I don't recall the precise numbers, but IIRC ('normal') sugars don't provide an enormous storage efficiency advantage, so might need to think of something else. Quick wiki check gives sugars 17MJ/kg, while fats get 37.
I was suggesting sugars because you specified "not fat", but mobilizing fat reserves has more potential for liver failure. Malnutrition causes mobilization of fat, which can choke the liver, leading to fatty liver, and then we're back to liver failure again. Plus pressure of your engorged liver on your other abdominal organs and the enormous amount of heat being produced by your liver struggling to process everything (which is wasted calories and also gives you a fever).
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:33 AM   #28
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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*shrug*
You're the first one to bring up the FP cost build (in reply to the LFP ideas), not Patrick.
I was very specifically speaking about Costs FP as it stands in RAW (which is contentious). That's it.
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:49 AM   #29
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

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I was suggesting sugars because you specified "not fat", but mobilizing fat reserves has more potential for liver failure. Malnutrition causes mobilization of fat, which can choke the liver, leading to fatty liver, and then we're back to liver failure again. Plus pressure of your engorged liver on your other abdominal organs and the enormous amount of heat being produced by your liver struggling to process everything (which is wasted calories and also gives you a fever).
Oh well, I was hoping for something that is better than fats, but I guess that's not much of an option. Not with anything resembling mammalian biochemistry, it seems. I'll have to break out the bio-alchemy then. And liver upgrades.
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Old 09-29-2016, 09:00 AM   #30
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Default Re: Semi-realistic Regeneration and corresponding Increased Consumption

Since you're talking about nanites, other options would be things artificial sources, like a battery pack or more high-energy reactions that would be dangerous to do right in the circulatory system but could be done in little "reactor units" distributed around the body. By reactor I mean chemical reactor, not nuclear - I don't think you want RTGs in your body at any TL :D
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