[Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Vow

[ericthered]

In previous disadvantages of the week, we've discussed how about half of all pacifism can be framed as a vow. You can put other requirements on combat through vow as well.

We also got into the honesty disadvantage, and several posters suggested that it might be best to use vow, with the exact behavior specified

A stack of Quirk-Level vows can often be better represented as a code of honor or disciplines of faith.

[Anders]

Originally Posted by ericthered

In previous disadvantages of the week, we've discussed how about half of all pacifism can be framed as a vow. You can put other requirements on combat through vow as well.

Truthfulness and Vow of Truth are similar, but Truthfulness includes people who have no problem with lying, they're just very bad at it.

[Say, it isn't that bad!]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

It does? I think I missed that, what evidence?

I think this is what you missed:

Originally Posted by Say, it isn't that bad!

I think the general idea is that the character was already going to commit murder (in the case of Secret (serial killer) and Vow (only kill on halloween)); the Vow simply sets the local planetary date/time.

And I think having to commit said murder on 1 specific day out of 365 (and a bit) makes it worth more; about [-5].

Remember, that is more, and very specific, information that the police/city guard/station security AI/local superheroes/etc can use to not only track down, intercept, and locate the perpetrator; but to identify that there is a serial killer in the first place.

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Say, it isn't that bad!

I think the general idea is that the character was already going to commit murder (in the case of Secret (serial killer) and Vow (only kill on halloween)); the Vow simply sets the local planetary date/time.

And I think having to commit said murder on 1 specific day out of 365 (and a bit) makes it worth more; about [-5].

Remember, that is more, and very specific, information that the police/city guard/station security AI/local superheroes/etc can use to not only track down, intercept, and locate the perpetrator; but to identify that there is a serial killer in the first place.

I would think if you're committing only one murder per year without ritualistic elements besides the date tying them together, it would be extremely hard for them to come to the conclusion that there is a serial killer at work, let alone draw any useful conclusions beyond that.

...though that depends on the size of the community. If you're in a small town where the Halloween murders constitute a large fraction of the homicides, it'll stand out strongly after a few years and probably be common speculation after just two or three. In a big city, much less so. NYC averaged more than one murder per day each year from 1959 through 2012.

[Say, it isn't that bad!]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

I would think if you're committing only one murder per year without ritualistic elements besides the date tying them together, it would be extremely hard for them to come to the conclusion that there is a serial killer at work, let alone draw any useful conclusions beyond that.

...though that depends on the size of the community. If you're in a small town where the Halloween murders constitute a large fraction of the homicides, it'll stand out strongly after a few years and probably be common speculation after just two or three. In a big city, much less so. NYC averaged more than one murder per day each year from 1959 through 2012.

That suggests a scaling by settlement size for the Vow; perhaps up to [-10] in a village, and [-1] in a metropolis?

[Mr_Sandman]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

...though that depends on the size of the community. If you're in a small town where the Halloween murders constitute a large fraction of the homicides, it'll stand out strongly after a few years and probably be common speculation after just two or three. In a big city, much less so. NYC averaged more than one murder per day each year from 1959 through 2012.

I'd wager a guess that a lot of those murders in New York had clear motives involved; many were probably related to domestic abuse or criminal activities. The part of the vow that requires an innocent victim, so there is no obvious motive, combined with the fact that it was always on Halloween could very well be a pattern that would be recognized even in a city with an average of more than one homicide a day. The random murder of an upright citizen with no obvious enemies every year, on that particular day of the year would probably be noticed. That doesn't mean that it would be easy to catch the killer, but it probably could be identified as a serial killer. If the killer traveled to different jurisdictions for each murder, that might make it harder to spot.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

I would think if you're committing only one murder per year without ritualistic elements besides the date tying them together, it would be extremely hard for them to come to the conclusion that there is a serial killer at work, let alone draw any useful conclusions beyond that.

...though that depends on the size of the community. If you're in a small town where the Halloween murders constitute a large fraction of the homicides, it'll stand out strongly after a few years and probably be common speculation after just two or three. In a big city, much less so. NYC averaged more than one murder per day each year from 1959 through 2012.

The killer would pretty quickly settle into a set modus operandi he felt comfortable with even ignoring the fact that "sacrifice" strongly implies ritual elements. The only way to go unnoticed would be to have a way of disposing the body so it wouldn't be found

[dcarson]

I remember a talk by I think a senior detective for New Orleans that they only have a handful of surprising murders a year. House that has had multiple domestic violence calls, taxi driver/convenience store clerk on the night shift, drug dealer, someone in the club/bar/etc. field. Lots. Out of the blue where you never would have expected it, a handful.

[kirbwarrior]

Originally Posted by Say, it isn't that bad!

That suggests a scaling by settlement size for the Vow; perhaps up to [-10] in a village, and [-1] in a metropolis?

Originally Posted by Mr_Sandman

If the killer traveled to different jurisdictions for each murder, that might make it harder to spot.

See, I was imagining the character in question travels, which can make things much harder to trace. Which has a further effect on these things.

Originally Posted by dcarson

I remember a talk by I think a senior detective for New Orleans that they only have a handful of surprising murders a year. House that has had multiple domestic violence calls, taxi driver/convenience store clerk on the night shift, drug dealer, someone in the club/bar/etc. field. Lots. Out of the blue where you never would have expected it, a handful.

Which feels like a great thing to take advantage of.

[Say, it isn't that bad!]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

Which feels like a great thing to take advantage of.

...On the alignment chart, GURPS would be True Neutral.