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Old 06-26-2022, 03:50 PM   #21
FrackingBiscuit
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by Anaraxes View Post
That's merely "harder to get", not "impossible".
It might very well mean impossible. Just because I can theoretically acquire illegal weapons in real life that would be LC1 in GURPS doesn't mean I can always buy LC1 weapons in any campaign I play. Hence why I gave different suggestions for different LCs, since we don't actually know what limits the players are facing.
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Old 06-26-2022, 07:38 PM   #22
KarlKost
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
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Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by Willy View Post
If you cansider using a rifle, most nations allow hunters some rifles who met the caliber and precision of a sniper rifle. A shotgun is a option for close combat albeit civillian shotguns have reduced ammo or just a side by side barrel.

Also a hunting license allows for the transport of this toys without much questions. Including ammo and guns, a back up handgun included.

So your "only" problem is to get for civillians illegal as hell ammo.
Here in Brazil you cant get a fire weapon legally. At all. Period. No discussion. And of any kind.

If you're a criminal thou, you can get even bazookas and grenades... And sometimes even anti helicopter missiles (no, Im not joking, that has been taken from gangs here).

But not even a handgun pistol legally.
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Old 06-26-2022, 07:41 PM   #23
KarlKost
 
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Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by FrackingBiscuit View Post
Well, if the characters are in the UK, handguns are totally out of the question anyway. To my understanding any cartridge-firing handgun is banned. Given that the player in question is looking for one, I'm assuming the characters themselves aren't in the UK (or have some way around its laws).
The difference between using a handgun and an assault rifle in the UK aint so much about the legality of thoae, and more about how easily you can conceal them.
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Old 06-26-2022, 08:38 PM   #24
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by KarlKost View Post
Here in Brazil you cant get a fire weapon legally. At all. Period. No discussion. And of any kind.
However, it must be legal to export Brazillian-made guns to the US. All those Taurus models have to come from somewhere.
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Old 06-27-2022, 05:23 AM   #25
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Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by Racer View Post
I'm not sure barring some sort of rocket type fuel that any current or proposed propellents will be able to function outside a oxygenated atmosphere ?
Firearm propellents contain their own oxidizer, so they work okay without atmospheric oxygen. In a vacuum, lubricantion and heat dissipation are the problems.
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Old 06-27-2022, 09:19 AM   #26
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Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

In the WWI weapon thread (over in Roleplaying in General), one thing I mentioned as a possibility was a handgun firing rifle-caliber bullets. One problem there was that it would have to be a revolver, because you can't fit a rifle magazine into a grip that is comfortable to a human. But propellant investments improvements mean you potentially could, by fitting as much power into a handgun-sized cartridge as you usually have in a rifle cartridge. It's not going to be pleasant to fire, and you'll be wasting a lot of the energy due to the shorter barrel, but it's a potential option.

In terms of projectile, it's really tough to beat APHEX (Armor Piercing High EXplosive). It's armor-piercing, letting you get through a monster's tough hide or a vampire wearing concealable body armor, but also explosive, so it still produces a massive wound channel. Arguably, while I don't think it functions like this in GURPS, it should improve Pi-class by one step (like HP/Frangible) in addition to the internal explosion. I'm not sure if modern APHEX will reliably explode when used against soft targets, however, but maybe that's a non-issue by the time period of the campaign. You'll probably need a wide caliber, so ammunition capacity will likely be low. You can also sacrifice some of the explosive payload to have some sort of "poison" that is particularly effective against your target, at least so long as being inside an explosive won't ruin it (silver is probably fine; wolfsbane may end up too "cooked" from the explosion to be effective).

If you really want balls-to-the-walls ridiculous and have access to either LP or electromagnetic acceleration*, you could have one weapon system that can serve as both a handgun and a rifle. You start with a handgun, with both the bullets and the "propellant" - either the binary fluid explosive for LP, or the power cell for EM - in a magazine that slots up into the grip, using the weapon at a low velocity setting. When you instead need a rifle, you slap on a stock and attach a barrel extender, and crank up the velocity to full. Either the stock or barrel extender (or both!*) should also have a place on it for a propellant bottle or a larger power cell (and in the latter case, the extender would have built-in accelerators), and be able to feed to the weapon so it has enough power to do its thing (using rifle-powered shots will use up the propellant in the magazine rather quickly). By necessity, the pistol portion at least would weigh more than a typical pistol of its size and power (because it needs to be sturdy enough to withstand use at rifle power), and the whole rifle probably would weigh more than a typical rifle of its size and power (being modular isn't without drawbacks), but only needing one type of ammunition for both - and being able to switch things up with different length extensions, so you can basically have a pistol that becomes an SMG when you add a stock, which becomes a carbine with one barrel extender, which becomes a full-sized rifle with another barrel extender (either a different one, or perhaps two connected together) - seems like it could potentially be rather useful. Realistically, you'd need to re-zero the weapon once you put those extenders on, but if you're in a setting that's cinematic enough you could just slap a scope on and use it without needing to zero it first, that shouldn't be an issue (you might also simply claim that improved precision in craftsmanship makes it work fine).

*Or neither - maybe it would work best to just have the port for an extra propellant bottle/power cell be part of the pistol base, immediately in front of the trigger guard.
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Last edited by Varyon; 06-27-2022 at 09:53 AM. Reason: I have no idea why I wrote investments there...
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Old 06-27-2022, 09:40 AM   #27
Willy
 
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Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

There is at least one of the shelf pistol firing 7,62 NATO, but it has a really small mag. I think it was a Automag or so.

Of course you can custom make a handgun for nearly any ammo, with the risk of a broken wrist. A one shot handgun is quite easy to make.
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Old 06-27-2022, 09:55 AM   #28
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by Willy View Post
There is at least one of the shelf pistol firing 7,62 NATO, but it has a really small mag. I think it was a Automag or so.
.
I have neer heard of such a thing. Google doesn't seem to know it either and there are good reasons why it wouldn't work.

For one that 7.62 x 51mm cartridge is far longer than any pistol round. A long pistol case kis soemthing like 25mm. There have been semi-auto pistols made for the.357 Magnum (33mm i think) but their grips were odd-looking and unpopular.

You could make something that might be a pistol under US law (the current adminstration seems to have a different opinion than their predecessors) but it's really just the middle of an AR-style rifle with no shoulder stock and a short barrel. Very bulky and the magazine has to be in front of the trigger.
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Old 06-27-2022, 10:08 AM   #29
FrackingBiscuit
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
In the WWI weapon thread (over in Roleplaying in General), one thing I mentioned as a possibility was a handgun firing rifle-caliber bullets.
High-Tech 3e has the Thompson Contender, a single-shot target pistol firing 5.56mm NATO.
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Old 06-27-2022, 10:31 AM   #30
Varyon
 
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Default Re: Ideas:'Revolutionary' late 2030s Handgun for Black Ops/Horror/lite Sci-Fi setting

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Originally Posted by Willy View Post
There is at least one of the shelf pistol firing 7,62 NATO, but it has a really small mag. I think it was a Automag or so.
Some Googling shows several 7.62 NATO "pistols," but those all have the magazine well right in front of the trigger guard, rather than in the grip - but with a nearly 3-inch-long cartridge, going in the grip is simply not an option. The problem with that design is that it more-or-less completely eliminates the advantage of a pistol - easy to carry in and draw from a holster. Those types of weapons I think are more about getting around legal restrictions/definitions than actually being practical as a pistol - put an arm brace (which can be used as a stock) on it, and you've got something that's legally and definitionally a pistol but for all intents and purposes a carbine-sized rifle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FrackingBiscuit View Post
High-Tech 3e has the Thompson Contender, a single-shot target pistol firing 5.56mm NATO.
That's a single-shot weapon, which I don't think will work well as a sidearm. Needing to be a revolver is a limitation because it means the weapon can't hold as many shots and is slower to reload than a semi-automatic pistol; a single shot weapon is even worse.
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