Less than one hex monster

[Steve Plambeck]

Wracking my brain for how I used to handle this. I used labeled 1-hex counters that represented 10 rats each (same for bats and spiders) and still have them, but can't find the instruction sheet I wrote to go with them.

I allowed 1 counter of rats to stack with the victim they were attacking, and had some neat shortcut for what to do next. The rat counter had an effective ST of 10, one for each rat. When a rat was killed, I tallied 1 hit against the ST of the "figure". It only took 1 hit of damage to kill a rat, but a lone character could normally only swat, stomp and kill two per turn. A rat counter would not be removed until reduced to ST zero.

I think the rest went something like: 1 counter of rats did 1d6 damage to whomever they were stacked with, but the damage was -1 for each hit the rat counter had taken. So if 3 rats had been killed, the rat counter did (1-3) damage. If 6 rats had been killed it did (1-6) damage, which is to say zero; 4 rats or less couldn't hurt anyone.

Now for my fun part <eg>. Although only one rat counter could stack on the victim's hex and attack once per turn, there could be up to 6 adjacent rat counters surrounding the character -- a megahex of rats. And during the movement phase, I allowed rats from the adjacent counters to move into and replace any rats that had been killed in the rat counter stacked with the victim.

The bookkeeping was easy. I had a record sheet listing the ST of each counter. So all I had to do was move the hits tallied for the attacking counter to any combination of the adjacent rat counters, until the attacking counter was back at its full ST of 10 for the combat phase of the turn, meaning the next attack would be back to 1d6 damage if the victim didn't act first and successfully kill a rat, reducing the rats' damage roll to (1-1).

So if the victim just stood there letting rats swarm and replenish the attacking rat counter, and with no friends helping them swat, they could be in serious trouble in just a few turns unless wearing at least chainmail. A naked figure killing one rat per turn would be taking an average of 2.5 hits per turn.

In my counters collection I have about 30 of these 10-rat counters. Get through the chamber of 300 rats, the reward could be facing the chamber of 300 bats next :)

[Axly Suregrip]

Original Deathtest (or Deathtest 1) allowed up to 12 spiders to jump onto one character. So, this ITL limit of 2 rats per hex is new in legacy ITL (it was not in old ITL). Even legacy ITL goes on to talk about how the rats bites are cumulative, but within a turn, as if there would be lots of rats on you.

I like Shostak's fraction representation to determine number of smaller creatures allowed in HTH.

BTW, isn't it ironic that normal 1 hex creatures do not have a limit how many can be in HTH? Or did that change in Legacy too?

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip

Original Deathtest (or Deathtest 1) allowed up to 12 spiders to jump onto one character. So, this ITL limit of 2 rats per hex is new in legacy ITL (it was not in old ITL).

That makes it look like it was a simple typographical error with a dropped tens column “1”. 12 rats would make more sense than two!

[Axly Suregrip]

Reading it again, I think it means that the 2 rats per hex is the amount of rats when not in HTH.

So, then it could be unlimited in HTH.

[phiwum]

Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip

Reading it again, I think it means that the 2 rats per hex is the amount of rats when not in HTH.

So, then it could be unlimited in HTH.

At first, I thought you were just wrong to mention HTH, but then I realized a rat is to a person as a person is to an ogre and a person can attack an ogre in HTH (though the ogre is still standing). So, the rat is sorta in HTH when he swarms a person, though the person is NOT in HTH. Is that what you had in mind?

The unlimited number of figures that can be in a single hex in HTH is kinda odd. I think I'd cap it at two per side with one hex figures. Or else, I'd make it a larger than one hex melee, but then you shouldn't be able to hit any opponent you want to, since some would be out of reach.

[ParadoxGames]

Originally Posted by Shostak

I'd say that yes, multiple small figures like dragonets could be in one's hex at the same time to attack.

Take a look at my solution for several small assailants encumbering a larger one in my grappling rules.

I also think the official rule on 2/hex stacking limit for things like rats [ITL 100] is far too low. It would be better to give small figures a fractional hex size so that the stacking could be quickly determined by whatever number of them is required to equal a size of 1 hex, e.g. if rats were determined to be 1/10-hex, 10 could occupy one hex.

I've played some scenarios with rats and (1/2") rat counters, and the 2/hex limit is one of those instances where game dynamics trumps realism. Rats are a nuisance creature. Allowing more than 2 per hex, when 25 to 50 of them attack a party of 32-point characters, elevates rats to a formidable threat. At least, they can really score a lot of damage.

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by ParadoxGames

I've played some scenarios with rats and (1/2") rat counters, and the 2/hex limit is one of those instances where game dynamics trumps realism. Rats are a nuisance creature. Allowing more than 2 per hex, when 25 to 50 of them attack a party of 32-point characters, elevates rats to a formidable threat. At least, they can really score a lot of damage.

The best fix for this is to give the critters a DX lower than 10. At DX 9, their likelihood of scoring a hit is just over 1/3, and at DX 8, they will only inflict 1 damage about a quarter of the time.

[Axly Suregrip]

I wonder if there should be a fixed ratio for number of figures in HTH.

For example, with regular 1 hex fighters (say, humans), how many in HTH until the hex is full? Normally it is 1 human per hex, but in HTH say the max would be 4.

And then we can take this and just say the hex to HTH hex ratio should be 1 to 4. That is, since rats are 2 per hex normally, they would be 8 per hex for HTH.

What would be a good ratio?

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip

I wonder if there should be a fixed ratio for number of figures in HTH.

For example, with regular 1 hex fighters (say, humans), how many in HTH until the hex is full? Normally it is 1 human per hex, but in HTH say the max would be 4.

And then we can take this and just say the hex to HTH hex ratio should be 1 to 4. That is, since rats are 2 per hex normally, they would be 8 per hex for HTH.

What would be a good ratio?

That’s certainly logical and simple, but it seems that a hex with three humans in it should still be able to accommodate more than two rats.

[Steve Plambeck]

Perhaps a better way to think of a bunch of small, swarming creatures would be to compare it to a Fire hex, but a Fire hex with an MA capable of moving.

4 hits per turn (as in Fire) is way too much for rats, at least normal rats, but a damage of say approximately (1-3) could be assigned for being stacked a whole turn with a counter representing the swarm. I also wouldn't want to make a "to hit" roll for every single rat, just a single damage roll which itself is taking into account that on any given turn more rats will land bites than others. As I suggested earlier, the damage per turn could be 1d6, but -1 hit for every hit damage the rat formation had taken.

Assigning any fixed number of rats to a rat counter would be entirely symbolic, so call it any number you want. The formation represented by a 1-hex counter becomes just another 1-hex figure, having whatever attributes and damage capability that sounds reasonable to the GM.