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Old 12-15-2020, 04:28 PM   #31
The Colonel
 
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Default Re: Gurps SOE Weapons?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HANS View Post
With suppressed weapons, "quiet" is a relative thing. People don't appreciate how LOUD real firearms are. They are really, really loud. Crank up the volume to 10 while watching Mann's HEAT and you still won't experience it properly. Practically all of them are above the sound level that is painful, let alone damaging to the human ear.
Doing away with that BANG or BOOM is a substantial achievement, but you really can't remove the mechanical noises that come from operating the action, let alone the travel and impact of the bullet. The De Lisle was a bit quieter than the STEN Mk IIS, but not significantly so. This is from Paulson SILENCER (2002), who researched this extensively.
McCollum of FORGOTTEN WEAPONS has several videos showing this; while they aren't directly comparable due to set-up and recording equipment, they still show some of the issues (note that the WWII samples are reproductions):

https://www.forgottenweapons.com/val...-at-the-range/
https://www.forgottenweapons.com/sho...ssed-sten-gun/
https://www.forgottenweapons.com/mp5...vs-supersonic/

Cheers

HANS
Cool - always good to hear from GJ. Speaking of which, I notice it's only the DeLisle for which he drops his ear defenders...

...and although he doesn't fire it, here he is with a Welrod. He grants it the "quietest firearm" rep and states that within 15' it's not identifiable as a gunshot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d12A...XgJuA&index=18

Last edited by The Colonel; 12-15-2020 at 04:39 PM.
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Old 12-15-2020, 06:08 PM   #32
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
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Default Re: Gurps SOE Weapons?

Can't find anything anywhere near as quality about a PSS, though there's this.
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Old 12-18-2020, 02:47 AM   #33
borithan
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Default Re: Gurps SOE Weapons?

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Originally Posted by The Colonel View Post
I'd not heard of a copy of the supressed Sten, but stranger things have happened - like the Potsdam gerat. I'm not Skorzeny, but I would suspect that any "clandestine operation" that involves the enemy inspecting your equipment down to the armourer's stamps is a bad plan.
Sorry, realise I was a bit unclear there, multiple thoughts in my sentence that run together. I am not aware of any copies of the silenced version, just the copies of the standard version, and then their own last ditch version (which had the downward pointing magazine, and so definitely not intended to try and pass for an original) in the final stages of the war.

The story about the silenced version was just that some German (it might have been Skorzeny) was allegedly much impressed by the silenced sten. Some story about emptying one into a bush behind some other officers to show how quiet it was. However, as I understand it, that was *not* the way the silenced version was meant to be used, as the suppressor lost effectiveness within a burst quickly, and it would quickly wear out the suppressor as well. It was meant to be used semi-auto, and even then I think had a lifetime of a couple hundred rounds.

But yeah, I dont know what plan would rely on the armourer's stamps being correct (particularly given they were estimated by some to have made 10,000 of the things?), and even if that was the case, why not use stocks of captured stens, of which they had plenty?

Quote:
As to the Welrod having the reputation of the quietest firearm ever made - I'd not heard that, but again, it may be so. Personally I suspect some of the modern captive bolt cartridges must be quieter, but who knows.
Maybe, wasn't aware of those.
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