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Old 06-09-2014, 06:54 PM   #111
Hans Rancke-Madsen
 
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

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Originally Posted by combatmedic View Post
FTL= poor science education

It's not possible, Flyn.

Why can you accept it, but not a miracle star system?
In my case it would be because I can't internalize the 'FTL = causality violation' bit. I'll take Einstein's word for it (since it has been vouched by so many other scientists). I've even had it explained to me and understood it (although I forgot (mentally rejected?) the explanation again fairly quickly). But I just can't accept, emontionally, that I can't move at any speed I like, spend some time wherever I went, fly back again, and some reasonable time has now elapsed. It just doesn't make sense. Emotional sense, that is.

So FTL travel may be impossible, but it ought not to be, while miracle systems are just silly.


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Old 06-09-2014, 07:08 PM   #112
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

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Originally Posted by ak_aramis View Post
The lack of FTL (albeit having what looks to be STL Alcubierre-style warp drive) makes the setting constrained in a way different from a significant FTL drive setting would be.
One other issue to be thought of, disappearing in an STL-verse pretty much requires the person looking for you to quit looking at you.

Assuming Serenity has a non-magical drive and makes trips on the order of days or weeks instead of months or years (in a single biggish star system), it's going to be trivial to spot its drive plume from anywhere unless it is occluded by a planet or star. And given the Alliance controls the Core Worlds, it's unlikely to ever be in every interested party's blind spot. Burn the engines, and everyone knows where you are, what you are, where you're going, and when you'll get there.

So really, the question isn't a choice between impossible FTL and implausible star system. It's Magic A or Magic B (or sensor capability far worse than we have today).
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Old 06-09-2014, 07:15 PM   #113
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

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Originally Posted by combatmedic View Post
Why can you accept it, but not a miracle star system?
Maybe because FTL is simpler?

A single black box (or peculiar Steampunk spinning Thing) in the engine room is also smaller and less intrusive than very large black boxes that can re-make planets in negligible timespans.

It's a principle of world creation elegance that you don't make your story enabling miracles larger and more intrusive than they need to be.
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Old 06-09-2014, 07:40 PM   #114
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

Ftl is almost universally rationalized by the conventions of a hypothetical coexistent universe, subuniverse, pocket universe, whatever. We can make those conventions what is convenient for the story. A star that carries several dozen planets each terraformable exists in OUR universe.
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Old 06-09-2014, 08:25 PM   #115
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

FTL isn't needed. An open cluster that takes a couple of years to cross wouldn't make the setting less like the frontier in the 19th century.
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Old 06-09-2014, 08:45 PM   #116
Hans Rancke-Madsen
 
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
FTL isn't needed. An open cluster that takes a couple of years to cross wouldn't make the setting less like the frontier in the 19th century.
Interesting concept. How close can you pack stars to get an SLT accessible cluster? And by packing stars I mean worldbuilding while remaining sorta plausible.


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Old 06-09-2014, 08:52 PM   #117
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

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Originally Posted by Hans Rancke-Madsen View Post
Interesting concept. How close can you pack stars to get an SLT accessible cluster? And by packing stars I mean worldbuilding while remaining sorta plausible.
A typical open cluster's core is about 3-4 light-years across with a density of about 1.5 stars per cubic light year. The corona is about 5 times that diameter with a decreasing density. Globular clusters, of course are bigger and denser, but are terrible environments for habitable planets.
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Old 06-09-2014, 09:36 PM   #118
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

It has to start with a star that can be reached from Earth. Centauri is already four light years.
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Old 06-09-2014, 09:48 PM   #119
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

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Originally Posted by combatmedic View Post
If they had such amazing terraforming tech, why not terraform Earth back into a livable state?
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There are some quirky things in the Firefly backstory. I'm not saying they can't be explained. I'm only pointing out that they do seem to require further explanation (or not, maybe it doesn't matter for the stories being told...).
Which is what got me started on the musing that lead to this thread.

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Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
I can't think of any vaguely realistic problem other than the clichéd grey goo scenario that would make earth truly uninhabitable.
It's best to keep it mysterious and unknown by the characters rather than try to explain or lampshade it.
Besides grey goo, there might be someone/thing intelligent and hostile in the Solar system that the refugees wanted to get away from.

My favorite idea would be something like the Comprise from Michael Swanwick's Vacuum Flowers. A technological hivemind that incorporates anyone it can get by force. In VF it can't leave Earth because the more than a second of communications lag causes hivemind schisms, which are Bad Things.

For the psuedo-Firefly setting, assume it can handle a few days of lag, but not more.

We could make Firefly a VF sequel if we worked at it. The very end of the story has almost as fast as light inertialess travel invented and colonies setting off into interstellar space, because Earth just got an anti-schism mind technology.
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Old 06-09-2014, 09:51 PM   #120
David Johnston2
 
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Default Re: Rationalizing a Firefly - Serenity type setting

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
FTL isn't needed. An open cluster that takes a couple of years to cross wouldn't make the setting less like the frontier in the 19th century.
The Hyades cluster is 150 light years away with about 160 F, G, and K stars packed within ten light years and would be a pretty interesting setting for a space opera game.
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