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Old 11-11-2019, 08:21 AM   #1
Anders
 
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Default KYOS and ST-based skills

The primary reason there are no ST-based skills is that ST varies more widely than other attributes. But in KYOS*, the ST-scale is mightily compressed, with ST 32 (vanilla) equaling ST 20 (KYOS). Do you think it would be wise to change some skills to ST-based (I'm looking at Forced Entry and Lifting) in a game that uses KYOS?

* KYOS = Knowing Your Own Strength, Pyramid #3/83.
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Last edited by Anders; 11-11-2019 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 11-11-2019, 08:43 AM   #2
naloth
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Default Re: KYOS and ST-based skills

I don't see the advantage.

Skills offer an alternative way to increase ST or perform feats beyond your ST. If you base them on ST, you'll require a decent value to use the skill and any increase in your ST attribute will increase both your raw power and your effective training.

For example, a mouse that trains in Lifting benefits from a % bonus based on the skill rolls he can make. If you were to move Lifting to be based on ST, there would be little point for a mouse to take Lifting. Conversely the Hulk has a relatively high ST already (30-55 under KYOS depending on his temperament), should he be able to lift x6 times by dropping another point in Lifting?

Last edited by naloth; 11-11-2019 at 08:46 AM.
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Old 11-11-2019, 10:18 AM   #3
malloyd
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Default Re: KYOS and ST-based skills

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Originally Posted by Anders View Post
The primary reason there are no ST-based skills is that ST varies more widely than other attributes. But in KYOS*, the ST-scale is mightily compressed, with ST 32 (vanilla) equaling ST 20 (KYOS). Do you think it would be wise to change some skills to ST-based (I'm looking at Forced Entry and Lifting) in a game that uses KYOS.
I wouldn't see why. Assuming you aren't compressing *damage* scales, which will lead to other rather substantial departures from reality. Pretty much everything proposed as "ST-based" is really force level based, and becomes illogical as die roll against an ST score that covers a wide range of force levels.

Example: if you have a 50% chance to smash something applying force X, there's no realistic option of it surviving force 10X - so if 10 times the force is less than +8ST or so, the process will not make sense as a roll vs ST.
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Old 11-11-2019, 01:10 PM   #4
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: KYOS and ST-based skills

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anders View Post
The primary reason there are no ST-based skills is that ST varies more widely than other attributes. But in KYOS*, the ST-scale is mightily compressed, with ST 32 (vanilla) equaling ST 20 (KYOS). Do you think it would be wise to change some skills to ST-based (I'm looking at Forced Entry and Lifting) in a game that uses KYOS?
There's some argument for certain skills being ST-based and replacing ST in specific applications, though they'd probably have to be ST/E to have any point, and it's both unlikely to be cost effective and not very realistic to have them at more than about ST+2.
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