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Old 11-12-2007, 11:58 PM   #11
Pesterfield
 
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Default Re: GURPS Fantasy Question

It does list how some ads/disads/skills can be modified for both generic Fantasy and the Roma Arcana setting. It also has some options that can be added to normal magic, and a little discussion on alternatives to the normal system.

How to do racial templates is in Campaigns, but the Fantasy ones are good examples. I can't recall off hand, but think the Fantasy and Basic elves are different.
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Old 11-13-2007, 01:14 AM   #12
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Default Re: GURPS Fantasy Question

I found Fantasy to be a good inspiration, but the crunch was fuzzy. I mean, due to not giving some needed explanations, it spawned several rules arguments (e.g. Orcish Unfitness price), and had some loose ends rules-wise (some Talents with incomplete write-ups, the mysterious All-or-Nothing and Immediate Crippling modifiers). The genre discussion is interesting, but IMO too short. IMO the magic part and the Roma Arcana could've been dumped for the sake of increasing genre and other theoretical discussion. Especially the Magic part, since Fantasy was meant as a genrebook, while there is an independent (but badly-copy-pasted from 3e) crunckbook called Magic and the cool 'Third Core' book called Powers. Fantasy is not very useful for a GM concrete-set on her campaign style, but seems like an interesting theoretical reading material, especially for GMs new to fantasy.
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Old 11-13-2007, 07:05 AM   #13
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Default Re: GURPS Fantasy Question

However, I find it very useful, and yes, I am very fond of the "fluff" or theoretical-scholarship gaming stuff, but that is usual in a lot of good GURPS books.

IMO it isn't too crunchy because a lot of the needed crunchyness is well covered in the Basic Set (I am speaking here of the rule system and its details) and because it is a toolkit for helping you spawning your own settings with criteria, so the templates are IMHO mainly examples about how to do more on your own.

If you are mainly searching for already made templates for goblins, worgs, ogres, etc... this isn't the book, but again, the idea is you making your own templates.

That is one of the reasons for a lot of people here wishing the release of a 4e Fantasy Bestiary. Or simply put, a general Bestiary.

And yes, AFAIK 4e Banestorm provides as well some good and generic enough templates for adding to the collection, but they didn't repeat them in both books.

The pages dedicated to Magic discussion are good, too, for my taste and expectations. Ideas have an invaluable value and the book is full of good ones ready to be bumped to your game.

Overall, don't forget G4e Fantasy is, finally, the official ("non-Yrthish") GURPS undertake of the Fantasy genre.

Cheers
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Old 11-13-2007, 07:26 AM   #14
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Default Re: GURPS Fantasy Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by demonsbane
IMO it isn't too crunchy because a lot of the needed crunchyness is well covered in the Basic Set (I am speaking here of the rule system and its details) and because it is a toolkit for helping you spawning your own settings with criteria, so the templates are IMHO mainly examples about how to do more on your own.
Well said. It's like the Basic Set is when you buy your shiny tools and supplies, and Fantasy is when you get a collection of instructions what to build.
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Old 11-13-2007, 08:22 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InspectorGeneral
...it may not be what I was hoping for right now. I think I wanted the crunchy parts, and I'm wondering if it has the crunchy parts I want. Suggestions on point costs to be an Elf? Stats for Goblins?...
I think I'm in a similar place as you. Fantasy is for brainstorming about how a world is shaped by magic, war, etc. As a newbie, I was disapointed by its non-crunchiness, though I could see it being useful in the future. Banestorm has a section on non-human races (elves, etc.) and then a chapter on other creatures. There's enough there to get you going.
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Old 11-13-2007, 08:55 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by munin
I think I'm in a similar place as you. Fantasy is for brainstorming about how a world is shaped by magic, war, etc. As a newbie, I was disapointed by its non-crunchiness, though I could see it being useful in the future. Banestorm has a section on non-human races (elves, etc.) and then a chapter on other creatures. There's enough there to get you going.
Yes, and nevertheless, don't worry about that. Besides these templates, you can need then to draw from your desired sources (DnD for instance, Tolkien, Dark Eye, Dawnforge, Midnight, whatever) and translate it to GURPS mechanics.

That is one of the points of the system.

Meanwhile, G4e Fantasy will remain for you as a great point of reference.

BTW, here is a sample of some GURPS Fantasy material: ... after a while: I can't locate now the web site (it seems not working right now?), but it is the web of the forum member Collective Restraint, with some brilliant conversions from Dragonlance creatures, and other things.
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Old 11-13-2007, 10:20 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by demonsbane
That is one of the reasons for a lot of people here wishing the release of a 4e Fantasy Bestiary. Or simply put, a general Bestiary.
Wow. So everyone that runs GURPS Fantasy makes up their own stats for most creatures? I appreciate customization, but that seems excessive.

I suppose I could buy 3rd edition Bestiary and Fantasy Bestiary, but on top of still needing to buy the Campaigns Book and thinking I should have the Fantasy book... that's getting a bit pricey for a game I haven't even tried yet. Hmmm...

Thanks for all the advice and opinions, everyone. Part of the attraction of GURPS is the strong (and mature) support system it has.
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Old 11-13-2007, 10:31 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by InspectorGeneral
Wow. So everyone that runs GURPS Fantasy makes up their own stats for most creatures?
Well, GURPS Fantasy provides templates for 20 races, plus four undead lenses, and stats for seven monsters and six fantastic plants and animals. The latter are pretty much a sampler of "how to do it"; the former cover most of the races you would want for a classic multiracial fantasy campaign, including elves, dwarves, orcs, trolls, and dragons, for example.

But yes, Fantasy is not a bestiary, or a grimoire, or a catalog of magical items. It's a discussion of how the fantasy genre works. A lot of people find that useful. I do myself; one of my favorite GURPS books is Ken Hite's version of GURPS Horror, which is virtually entirely a discussion of literary tropes and how they can serve a GM's purposes.

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Old 11-13-2007, 11:02 AM   #19
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Default Re: GURPS Fantasy Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by InspectorGeneral
I suppose I could buy 3rd edition Bestiary and Fantasy Bestiary, but on top of still needing to buy the Campaigns Book and thinking I should have the Fantasy book... that's getting a bit pricey for a game I haven't even tried yet. Hmmm...
Remember that 3:rd ed books are cheap on w23. Also there is Creatures of the Night on e23, also very cheap.

Fantasy is IMHO such a good book that _any_ fantasy GM should buy one, no mater what system they GM in. Personally I'm fine with just Characters, Campaigns and Fantasy, but then I like making my on stats for things, and I feel that the magic system in GURPS is it's only weak point (don't like the feel of it at all) so I roll my own magic systems.
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Old 11-13-2007, 11:29 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whswhs
Well, GURPS Fantasy provides templates for 20 races, plus four undead lenses, and stats for seven monsters and six fantastic plants and animals. The latter are pretty much a sampler of "how to do it"; the former cover most of the races you would want for a classic multiracial fantasy campaign, including elves, dwarves, orcs, trolls, and dragons, for example.
Beautiful! That is what I wanted to hear. Truth be told, I don't want stats for hundreds of monsters I won't use. I just want some of the core ones - simple fantasy staples. Thank you for mentioning that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boobis
Fantasy is IMHO such a good book that _any_ fantasy GM should buy one, no mater what system they GM in. Personally I'm fine with just Characters, Campaigns and Fantasy, but then I like making my on stats for things, and I feel that the magic system in GURPS is it's only weak point (don't like the feel of it at all) so I roll my own magic systems.
I have Characters, and I just this morning managed to order Campaigns and Fantasy off of Chapters.ca for just over $20CDN each! 3-9 business days will feel like an eternity.

I was looking at the magic system in Characters last night, and at first glance I think I'm going to like it.

Thanks again everyone for the help!

EDIT: Also ordered the GURPS GM Screen for $15 CDN. In about two weeks, I'm going to feel good. :)
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Last edited by InspectorGeneral; 11-13-2007 at 11:46 AM.
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