What happens if; Points for gear

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by Maz

Yes I've come to use this page: https://water.roto.nu/seikkailu/doku...innate_attacks

And then the math tends to turn out pretty decently.

Interesting progression. Who runs the site?

[Maz]

Originally Posted by ericthered

Interesting progression. Who runs the site?

I dont know actually it was linked to me in an old thread I made about this issue and I have saved the link.

[kirbwarrior]

Originally Posted by Maz

Yes I've come to use this page: https://water.roto.nu/seikkailu/doku...innate_attacks

And then the math tends to turn out pretty decently.

That's not a bad idea. I use T Bone's ST costs and apply it to other linear traits;

https://www.gamesdiner.com/rules-nug...r-cost-for-st/
https://www.gamesdiner.com/2013/08/c...-level-traits/

It doesn't solve the problems of super vs robots vs cash perfectly. But it's been good enough for my campaigns so far. And I've devised 'buying off gadget limitations' for workarounds too.

But I think a core problem is; Why are 250pt PCs getting 1500pt gear?

[Anaraxes]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

Why are 250pt PCs getting 1500pt gear?

A question for the OP to answer, of course. But isn't that just the number he came up with when he took his desired equipment and totted up the points it would cost to buy the armor features as abilities to match those stats?

A buckets-ol-points strategy could be useful if the goal is to require having a base character that's relatively normal (if highly trained, at 250 points), while allowing a lot more points for "superpowers only". This distinction might help if the GM wants to run some adventures with the characters outside their mecha, solving problems without the armor, having social adventures, etc. Mages would muddy those waters a bit, though (unless those adventures conveniently take place in no mana zones, with the PCs drugged with magic inhibitors, or the magic rules require some physical item like having your spellbook to prep).

[kirbwarrior]

Originally Posted by Anaraxes

A question for the OP to answer, of course. But isn't that just the number he came up with when he took his desired equipment and totted up the points it would cost to buy the armor features as abilities to match those stats?

I find that in any campaign where absurd numbers are easily just bought that it's simpler to just buy them and then charge character points to only make them part of the character. I'd say Signature Gear is useful here, but I also use the DFRPG version (where it's a perk and you buy the gear with money) combined with being able to halve Wealth for Starting Money Only.

[onetrikpony]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

But I think a core problem is; Why are 250pt PCs getting 1500pt gear?

EDIT; just realized the real answer to this question is that; 250pt characters DO and CAN get 1500 pt gear; Easily, by RAW, in any setting. They do it with 30 points of Wealth, 30 points of Patron, for 200(ish)CP with (the often proscribed) Ally rules, or for 200(ish)CP with (no complaints) Altered Form. (Or, for free by GM Fiat if that's the game he wants to run)
At least those are the methods that have been suggested in the previous posts of this thread. Original post follows.

I thought I explained that in the original post but it's kind of become lost.

I'm pretty sure that I want a setting built around 250CP Heroes. I want Magic and Mecha and ancient evil.

In UT the TL10 battle suits are worth about 500 - 1000 CP. By which I mean, wearing a battle suit from the book can give you stats equivalent to a 1000CP character. Mecha designed from the old Mecha and Robots books just goes up from there. (Robots calculates a point equivalent for a (3E) robot character.)

If I wanted a Mechwarrior game the point cost would be fine. But I want a 'kitchen sink' game with magic mysticism AND mecha that's apocalyptic gritty and dark.

So my choices are shoehorning mecha into 250CP or dealing with 1500CP magic users.

Anyhow, once I started pricing gear with CP I started thinking about what gear does to character balance when the premise of the setting is very broad, and wanted some input from the community.

[kirbwarrior]

Okay, I think that all makes sense.

Originally Posted by onetrikpony

So my choices are shoehorning mecha into 250CP or dealing with 1500CP magic users.

If it's Magic the book, that magic is just broken especially at higher cp. If it's Magic as Advantages, then there's not much price difference in playing a robot vs mage vs gadgets (and gadgets eek ahead).

That's just by RAW. I've long used the 'buy off the gadget limitation' idea for helping characters stay somewhat close in power level regardless of how they do it.

I also am unsure if 250pts is the right area. Not that you're wrong for wanting it, but rather that you're doing a campaign where the PCs are allowed the ability to deal 10s of dice of damage and get DR 50+ (assuming that's a large part of the 1500pts), that usually means a higher power level and thus higher point total, regardless of the setting.

Lastly, if you are using Magic as Skills, you can just up the numbers that spells are capable of. If a damage spell is supposed to be comparable to damage gear can do, upgrade it accordingly; a regular missile does 1-3d under normal circumstances, a barbarian can hit 3d+6 fairly easily. If a gun that can be fairly easily bought is doing 12d(3) damage, that missile spell can be upgraded to 4-12d(3) damage, for example.

Originally Posted by onetrikpony

Anyhow, once I started pricing gear with CP I started thinking about what gear does to character balance when the premise of the setting is very broad, and wanted some input from the community.

That makes sense. Sorry if I came across as rude. I think the big thing to remember is that gear is normally not cp. When it becomes time to compare them, that is a breaking point.

[onetrikpony]

Originally Posted by kirbwarrior

250pts is the right area. Not that you're wrong for wanting it, but rather that you're doing a campaign where the PCs are allowed the ability to deal 10s of dice of damage and get DR 50+

I'm pretty comfortable with 250CP as Hero Level in the setting. Fewer points should be a survivable option. More points (in a magic character) makes the opposition factions fail to work.

10's of dice of damage and DR 50+ is the basic standard for a TL10 game with combat elements. I just thought I was providing an alternate path besides Wealth or Patron but it turned out I'd done the math wrong and other avenues cost 2-3 times as much.

I appreciate the input.