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Old 09-11-2014, 12:42 PM   #11
martinl
 
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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HELICARRIER
...
Cost: $1,771M
...
Labs, Science!: 20 (40), $600M
1/3 of the cost of the whole thing is labs? ... Yeah, I can see that.

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Complete lack of streamlining would be dumb. Is S.H.I.E.L.D. supposed to be dumb?
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. That's actually a very difficult call to make about cinematic organizations, because sometimes they have to be dumb because of Plot!, or SFX!, or whatever.

See the discussion earlier this week trying to reconcile what Starfleet is vs. what we actually see.
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Old 09-11-2014, 12:55 PM   #12
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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Originally Posted by martinl View Post
....

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. That's actually a very difficult call to make about cinematic organizations, because sometimes they have to be dumb because of Plot!, or SFX!, or whatever.

See the discussion earlier this week trying to reconcile what Starfleet is vs. what we actually see.
I have a severe cold so pardon me if I ramble or don't make sense for the next few days.

That is exactly the issue I have the Kirk thread too. Should we stat up what we see objectively, what the director and/or script intends us to take from it, or some versions of as realistic and coherent as possible given the limitations of genre and plot?
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Old 09-11-2014, 01:09 PM   #13
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
Should we stat up what we see objectively, what the director and/or script intends us to take from it, or some versions of as realistic and coherent as possible given the limitations of genre and plot?
Or a version that will, in your game, produce the effects you expect such a character to have. There's no one right answer here. You might have a game that wants to explore a "realistic Captain Kirk" in your gritty Federation, or you might want to create similar adventures with your own PCs, and have the legend guest star in one episode.
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Old 09-12-2014, 01:35 AM   #14
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
I have a severe cold so pardon me if I ramble or don't make sense for the next few days.

That is exactly the issue I have the Kirk thread too. Should we stat up what we see objectively, what the director and/or script intends us to take from it, or some versions of as realistic and coherent as possible given the limitations of genre and plot?
Link?

And how did the OP arrive at the number of workstations? I counted 16 systems requiring workstations, 3 each, that comes out to be 48 personal needed, and where did the 51 techs per shift come from?
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Old 09-12-2014, 01:51 AM   #15
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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And how did the OP arrive at the number of workstations? I counted 16 systems requiring workstations, 3 each, that comes out to be 48 personal needed, and where did the 51 techs per shift come from?
Every system except the three Armor systems requires Techs; 20-3=17*3=51. Per shift probably comes from the suggestion that Military Vessels usually carry more crew than necessary for damage control and casualty replacement purposes. Technically you could get away with the minimum of 51 technicians, but having multiple shifts gives you enough extra to handle emergencies. (I believe that USNavy vessels usually have two shifts, BTW).
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Old 09-12-2014, 10:59 AM   #16
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
What's the mass of a Quinjet? Or for those other planes (the sleek jets used by Victoria Hand and others) we see in AoS (I can't seem to find out what they are called, anybody?)?
The Quinjets appear about the same size as an Osprey, and those personnel jets used by Hand and Garrett seem to be around the size of a biggish Learjet. Unless they carry some amazingly heavy hardware, or I've underestimated the size, I'd call them both SM +5.
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Old 09-12-2014, 03:26 PM   #17
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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Originally Posted by tbrock1031 View Post
Okay, I didn't add the retro-reflective panels that make it virtually invisible from underneath. I was going for a somewhat more realistic version that would be fielded by a military than a spy agency's mobile HQ.
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You're also missing the stealth system.
Uh, yeah, that was intentional; the stealth system is TL 10^ (consider it a Dynamic Chameleon Hull), and I was shooting for TL8-ish technologies.

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Thanks for this! It helped much.

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Originally Posted by ericbsmith View Post
Every system except the three Armor systems requires Techs; 20-3=17*3=51. Per shift probably comes from the suggestion that Military Vessels usually carry more crew than necessary for damage control and casualty replacement purposes. Technically you could get away with the minimum of 51 technicians, but having multiple shifts gives you enough extra to handle emergencies. (I believe that USNavy vessels usually have two shifts, BTW).
I thought it was three 8-hour shifts, not two 12-hour shifts. But then, my knowledge of USN regs is several decades out of date. Either way, there's enough cabin space on this craft at SM +11 (much more at SM +12) to handle three shifts plus flight crews.
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Old 09-12-2014, 03:33 PM   #18
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

And updated the original post for the size increase to SM +12
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Old 09-12-2014, 04:19 PM   #19
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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Originally Posted by tbrock1031 View Post
I thought it was three 8-hour shifts, not two 12-hour shifts. But then, my knowledge of USN regs is several decades out of date. Either way, there's enough cabin space on this craft at SM +11 (much more at SM +12) to handle three shifts plus flight crews.
From some stuff I've read it's both yes and no. You'll have a primary job/shift that you'll work on for 8 hours, and then you'll have a secondary one you'll do another 4 hours on.
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Old 09-12-2014, 04:32 PM   #20
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Default Re: [Spaceships/Pyramid 3/34] SHIELD Helicarrier from Avengers

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Originally Posted by tbrock1031 View Post
Uh, yeah, that was intentional; the stealth system is TL 10^ (consider it a Dynamic Chameleon Hull), and I was shooting for TL8-ish technologies.
Emergent Superscience says you can adjust the introduction TL for superscience tech, which definitely seems appropriate for the MCU with it's flying cars, arc reactors, and repulsor tech.
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