Player wants GURPS version of D&D Weapon Focus feat?

[thom]

Sooo...one of my players wants the GURPS version of the D&D Weapon Focus feat. Basically, +1 "to hit" and halved Rapid Strike and Multiple Parries penalties for one weapon only (that's how the D&D version works).

Based on previous posts, I'm figuring the following cost:
* 1 character point for weapon bond with the specific weapon
* 6 character points for the ability to halve the Rapid Strike penalty
* 6 character points for the ability to halve the Mutiple Parries penalty, and
* 1 character point for an unusual background to allow the special feats listed under the Trained by a Master advantage with this one weapon,

...for a total of 14 character points. Am I missing anything? It does seem kinda pricey, but since TBAM is 30 points, and Weapon Master (one weapon) is 20 points it seems in the ballpark.

thom

[Anthony]

I would just say "buy weapon master (one weapon) and high weapon skill".

[Varyon]

Is this one weapon only ("The last sword my father made before he was murdered"), or one weapon design only (Thrusting Broadswords only, Late Katanas only, Dueling Halberds only, etc)? The latter is the way Weapon Focus worked in the edition of TOG that I played, as well as the way Weapon Master works in GURPS; the former is how Weapon Bond works in GURPS.

In either case, first we need Weapon Master (One Weapon), but without the damage bonus (you may want to check and see if the player is interested in the damage bonus, to save some headache; note that makes Weapon Master more akin to Weapon Focus + Weapon Specialization, if I'm remembering my Feats correctly). One could argue the damage bonus is roughly 1/3rd of the worth of Weapon Master, but by the same token in GURPS you usually pay more for a reduced capabilities than implied by its ability (as there's a built-in assumption that players will take Limitations that they can work around), so call it [20] (comparable to a -20% Limitation).

If you're going with a single design of weapon rather than an actual single weapon, that [20] works as-is, but you need to account for the +1 to skill. Either [2] or [3] should be fair - [1] gets you +1 with an actual single weapon, [4] gets you +1 with all weapons that use that skill, so the answer is somewhere in-between. Honestly, dropping the above to [17] or [18] and treating the bonus as [3] or [2], respectively, for an end cost of [20], is probably fair.

If you're going with an actual single weapon, [1] for the +1 (Weapon Bond) works, but [20] ([25] if the player opts to keep the damage bonus) is too much for the rest of the effects. If it's not a Signature Weapon, I'd say apply Gadget Limitations to that [20]. If it is a Signature Weapon, "Only With the Only Weapon I'll Ever Use Anyway" is probably a -5% or -10% Nuisance Effect instead (Signature Gear has plot protection... but you can be deprived of it for a short while, hence getting at least some discount).

[thom]

Originally Posted by Varyon

Is this one weapon only ("The last sword my father made before he was murdered"), or one weapon design only (Thrusting Broadswords only, Late Katanas only, Dueling Halberds only, etc)? The latter is the way Weapon Focus worked in the edition of TOG that I played, as well as the way Weapon Master works in GURPS; the former is how Weapon Bond works in GURPS.

If you're going with a single design of weapon rather than an actual single weapon, that [20] works as-is, but you need to account for the +1 to skill. Either [2] or [3] should be fair - [1] gets you +1 with an actual single weapon, [4] gets you +1 with all weapons that use that skill, so the answer is somewhere in-between. Honestly, dropping the above to [17] or [18] and treating the bonus as [3] or [2], respectively, for an end cost of [20], is probably fair.

I'm a little fuzzy on D&D but I think single-design of weapon is what I'm looking for. And Weapon Focus is only the first feat (in a long chain of feats) and only does +1 "to hit" - there's no damage bonus. Hmmm...it might be worth considering "downsizing" Weapon Master & modifying it to get what I'm looking for...

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by thom

And Weapon Focus is only the first feat (in a long chain of feats) and only does +1 "to hit" - there's no damage bonus.

I'm well aware. I believe at the least Fighters could get Weapon Focus (+1 to hit), then Weapon Specialization (+2 to damage), then Greater Weapon Focus (further +1 to hit, net +2), and finally Greater Weapon Specialization (further +2 to damage, net +4)... and I think it may have gone further as well.

But this is GURPS, not That Other Game. If the player is specifically wanting "Weapon Focus, and only Weapon Focus," then the above works (although the improved ability to attack multiple times like that doesn't really mesh with what Weapon Focus did, but whatever). If the player is wanting "A character who specializes in a certain make of weapon," like a Fighter going the Focus+Specialization+etc route, then just grabbing the equivalent of Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization makes sense, and makes things easier on you, the GM, as you can just say "Use Weapon Master" instead of having to build a custom version of it (although you'll still need to decide if the character has the option of a bonus to hit with just one make of weapon, and if so if this should cost [2], [3], or possibly something involving fractional point costs).

[whswhs]

It seems that the player wants, not a specific benefit, but an elaborate package that includes multiple benefits. And if it were my campaign, I wouldn't even try to replicate that particular package. It seems like an artifact of the D&D rules system, and I wouldn't be running D&D, but GURPS; if the GURPS rules system doesn't provide that same package deal, it's not my job to come up with an exact equivalent.

On one hand, you could just say, "tell me the specific advantages you want, and I'll tell you what they separately cost in GURPS." And the sum of those specific advantages is, in GURPS terms, the fair price for the combo that the player is asking for, anyway.

On the other hand, you could ask, "Never mind the rules mechanics. What's your concept of what the character has, in terms of narrative?" And if there were a story that held together, I might come up with a way to capture that story in terms of GURPS—the way I came up with Weapon Bond to capture a narrative bit from some fantasy stories (in particular, Heinlein's Glory Road).

On the gripping hand, you could look for an existing GURPS advantage that gives a comparable breadth of benefits. For what you describe, I might try Weapon Master for one specific weapon, costing 20 points.

But this idea that you ought to be able to sign up for a GURPS campaign, and play exactly the same character you played in some other campaign under some other set of rules, is one I'm basically inclined to reject in the first place.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by whswhs

On the other hand, you could ask, "Never mind the rules mechanics. What's your concept of what the character has, in terms of narrative?" And if there were a story that held together, I might come up with a way to capture that story in terms of GURPS—the way I came up with Weapon Bond to capture a narrative bit from some fantasy stories (in particular, Heinlein's Glory Road).

But this idea that you ought to be able to sign up for a GURPS campaign, and play exactly the same character you played in some other campaign under some other set of rules, is one I'm basically inclined to reject in the first place.

Yeah, I really try to avoid converting game mechanics, its typically a lot of wasted energy. Try to find the feel they are going for and build that.

If its I want to be really good at this one weapon thats easy. If its well in D&D I could hit 2/3 as often as I could with another weapon or whatever that's going to be more convoluted.

[thom]

Hmmm...good points all. I just realized I didn't mention in my original post that I'm not allowing any damage bonus with this advantage (hence my original build). Knowing that, do you still think 20 points is fair for the concept of: +1 to hit and halved Rapid Strikes and Multiple Parries with one type of weapon (i.e. any 1H broadsword)?

thom

[EDITED for clarity]

[Anthony]

The actual accurate way of writing up weapon focus in GURPS is:

+1 weapon skill [4].

Weapon focus in D&D doesn't give any bonuses to extra attacks, parries, or what have you; it's just a bonus to hit with a class of weapon that is only slightly narrower than GURPS skills.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by thom

Hmmm...good points all. I just realized I didn't mention in my original post that I'm not allowing any damage bonus with this advantage (hence my original build). Knowing that, do you still think 20 points is fair for the concept of: +1 to hit and halved Rapid Strikes and Multiple Parries with one type of weapon (i.e. any 1H longsword)?

Well, "longsword" isn't a category of weapons in GURPS. If what you mean is a sword that can be wielded one-handed, but is longer than a shortsword, the GURPS word for that is "broadsword." Unless you mean a fencing weapon of some sort.

It seems to me that you're dropping the damage bonus, but adding a skill bonus. I'm not sure if those two balance. If you kept the damage bonus, it would be 20 points for Weapon Master (one weapon) + 4 points for +1 skill, as Anthony says, for a total of 24 points.