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Old 04-14-2022, 08:15 AM   #41
Cheeseball
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Default Re: Ideas for a New long-term Campaign

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Originally Posted by Žorkell View Post
In that case, why did she move over to the Army?
To be able to run drugs, weapons, and slaves: to, from, and around third world countries. It's so much fun being evil. POWER! Who needs money when you can push people around and force them to do and give you what you want? I'm joking of course. But what I am about to tell you is a strict state secret: I wanted to be a spy and do exciting crime fighting overseas working with James Bond and Jason Bourne.
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Old 04-14-2022, 09:48 AM   #42
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The character is per the description in her late 20s. In that time she has undergone SEAL training, Delta training, training from the CIA and FBI, military officer training (she's a Major), and deployed six times. I'm sorry, but this feels like way to many events into a short time.
While I largely agree for a realistic campaign, the fact "superspy" is considered a legitimate character archetype for it indicates to me this campaign is sufficiently cinematic that a recent high-school graduate with a decade or more of combat experience* wouldn't really raise many eyebrows.

*And I'm suddenly reminded of the opening scene from Excel Saga. "Don't die on us, you've barely even begun to live your life!" *Bits of Excel's life flash before her eyes; the paramedic can somehow see this* "... nevermind."
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Old 04-14-2022, 11:32 AM   #43
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Default Re: Ideas for a New long-term Campaign

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While I largely agree for a realistic campaign, the fact "superspy" is considered a legitimate character archetype for it indicates to me this campaign is sufficiently cinematic that a recent high-school graduate with a decade or more of combat experience* wouldn't really raise many eyebrows.

*And I'm suddenly reminded of the opening scene from Excel Saga. "Don't die on us, you've barely even begun to live your life!" *Bits of Excel's life flash before her eyes; the paramedic can somehow see this* "... nevermind."
Actually, if she joined at seventeen, adding ten brings her to twenty-seven. As for the word super spy, I don't mean something cinematic, just a very accomplished spy, such as the Delta Force or the Special Activities Division (SAD) in the CIA according to the book "Spec Ops" (professional proficiency in a wide spectrum of espionage skills [up to level 13], expert proficiency in a few more [up to level 15], plus high combat ability both in martial arts and firearms [between 13 to 15 for the CIA, and up to 17 for the Delta Force]).

Edit. This is the number of skills this character has at each level:

World-Class (someone good enough to stand out in his field, however rarefied [top commando, ace of aces, etc.])
  • 2 at 17
  • 3 at 16
Elite (someone good enough to work under life-or-death conditions [including commandos, field surgeons, and ace pilots])
  • 23 at 15
  • 61 at 14
Good (primary job skills of most normal people [including cops, doctors, pilots, and soldiers])
  • 36 at 13
  • 17 at 12

Last edited by Cheeseball; 04-14-2022 at 11:44 AM.
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Old 04-14-2022, 11:51 AM   #44
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Default Re: Ideas for a New long-term Campaign

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Originally Posted by Cheeseball View Post
Actually, if she joined at seventeen, adding ten brings her to twenty-seven. As for the word super spy, I don't mean something cinematic, just a very accomplished spy, such as the Delta Force or the Special Activities Division (SAD) in the CIA according to the book "Spec Ops" (professional proficiency in a wide spectrum of espionage skills [up to level 13], expert proficiency in a few more [up to level 15], plus high combat ability both in martial arts and firearms [between 13 to 15 for the CIA, and up to 17 for the Delta Force]).
If the campaign is meant to be realistic rather than cinematic, I agree with the other posters that MAJ Mary Sue should either be older or less accomplished. As she stands, she may be within the range that a real human could accomplish, but is enough of an outlier to greatly strain one's sense of disbelief (sort of like James Bond, albeit to a lesser extent).

As an aside, however, I didn't mean "a decade of combat experience starting immediately after graduating high school," I meant "a decade of combat experience by the time she graduated high school," basically the less-creepy version of a child soldier that's pervasive in anime/manga.
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Old 04-14-2022, 12:02 PM   #45
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Default Re: Ideas for a New long-term Campaign

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Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
While I largely agree for a realistic campaign, the fact "superspy" is considered a legitimate character archetype for it indicates to me this campaign is sufficiently cinematic that a recent high-school graduate with a decade or more of combat experience* wouldn't really raise many eyebrows.

*And I'm suddenly reminded of the opening scene from Excel Saga. "Don't die on us, you've barely even begun to live your life!" *Bits of Excel's life flash before her eyes; the paramedic can somehow see this* "... nevermind."
Absolutely, i can 100% buy her character in a very cinematic context. “of course the child prodigy ex-sf is also beautiful. This is a movie, nobody is ever ugly in hollywood” . Outside of that context however she’d kind of cease to be believable.

edit: also she should probably have a much higher "soldier" it makes no sense that she would have the same amount of points in it as sex appeal if she really has ten years of combat experience.

Last edited by newton; 04-14-2022 at 01:57 PM.
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Old 04-14-2022, 05:08 PM   #46
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Default Re: Ideas for a New long-term Campaign

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If the campaign is meant to be realistic rather than cinematic, I agree with the other posters that MAJ Mary Sue should either be older or less accomplished. As she stands, she may be within the range that a real human could accomplish, but is enough of an outlier to greatly strain one's sense of disbelief (sort of like James Bond, albeit to a lesser extent).
That's my take. There isn't a hard reason to say that the character biography is impossible, but it is so improbable that it makes little difference.

She would be way too famous for her to do anything even remotely covert. And with her apparent personality, her security clearance psych profile might declare her a security risk. An enemy agent only has to present tasks as challenges and she couldn't resist.

Plus, there's the issue that this campaign might easily become "wait around until the badass GMPC shows up and makes us all look like chumps" (that could be completely unfair, but given what we have seen, that's the vibe I'm picking up).
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Old 04-14-2022, 06:30 PM   #47
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That's my take. There isn't a hard reason to say that the character biography is impossible, but it is so improbable that it makes little difference.

She would be way too famous for her to do anything even remotely covert. And with her apparent personality, her security clearance psych profile might declare her a security risk. An enemy agent only has to present tasks as challenges and she couldn't resist.

Plus, there's the issue that this campaign might easily become "wait around until the badass GMPC shows up and makes us all look like chumps" (that could be completely unfair, but given what we have seen, that's the vibe I'm picking up).
True, though she definitely has the skills to get back at the government for such a perceived slight. Like for instance pulling a big boss and use the combination of all those skills to form a PMC of her own(she does after all get about a +10 reaction bonus against a pretty damn significant portion of the world's armed forces)
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Old 04-14-2022, 08:51 PM   #48
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Plus, there's the issue that this campaign might easily become "wait around until the badass GMPC shows up and makes us all look like chumps" (that could be completely unfair, but given what we have seen, that's the vibe I'm picking up).
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True, though she definitely has the skills to get back at the government for such a perceived slight. Like for instance pulling a big boss and use the combination of all those skills to form a PMC of her own(she does after all get about a +10 reaction bonus against a pretty damn significant portion of the world's armed forces)
How? She is no better than any tier 1 spec op. Is she broad? Yes, because she has been trained by various services, and qualifies for all of them. Just put her up against another Delta Force, and her advantage is marginal, or put her up against an FSB Alpha Group member specializing in weapons, and in several circumstances she is at lost. For example:

Member of the FSB Alpha Group has:
  1. Guns (Grenade Launchers and Light Anti-Armor Weapons) at 16 vs her 15s.
  2. Stealth at 15 vs her 14.
  3. Knife at 16 vs her 14.

She also doesn't know how to fly a helicopter, or drive a tank, her medical skills are limited to First Aid, she barely has any professional proficiency in bomb disposal, she also doesn't know how to hack computers, she lacks any knowledge of decontamination beyond the use of NBC suits, she's no scientific brainiac beyond a mediocre 12 in Forensics, etc.
Take her on with two "average" special ops soldiers, for example, mercenary deserters from Chechen death squads, four corrupt part-time SWAT officers, eight trained terrorists, OR a couple dozen low-life gang members (such as 18th Street, Bloods, Crips, Latin Kings, MS-13, Trinitarios, etc.), and she will have a 50% chance of ending fatally.

Last edited by Cheeseball; 04-14-2022 at 09:01 PM.
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Old 04-14-2022, 10:41 PM   #49
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Default Re: Ideas for a New long-term Campaign

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Originally Posted by Cheeseball View Post
How? She is no better than any tier 1 spec op. Is she broad? Yes, because she has been trained by various services, and qualifies for all of them. Just put her up against another Delta Force, and her advantage is marginal, or put her up against an FSB Alpha Group member specializing in weapons, and in several circumstances she is at lost. For example:

Member of the FSB Alpha Group has:
  1. Guns (Grenade Launchers and Light Anti-Armor Weapons) at 16 vs her 15s.
  2. Stealth at 15 vs her 14.
  3. Knife at 16 vs her 14.

She also doesn't know how to fly a helicopter, or drive a tank, her medical skills are limited to First Aid, she barely has any professional proficiency in bomb disposal, she also doesn't know how to hack computers, she lacks any knowledge of decontamination beyond the use of NBC suits, she's no scientific brainiac beyond a mediocre 12 in Forensics, etc.
Take her on with two "average" special ops soldiers, for example, mercenary deserters from Chechen death squads, four corrupt part-time SWAT officers, eight trained terrorists, OR a couple dozen low-life gang members (such as 18th Street, Bloods, Crips, Latin Kings, MS-13, Trinitarios, etc.), and she will have a 50% chance of ending fatally.
She's definitely not a combat monster in the capabilities she has for her CP I'd give you that much, she's too generalist for that. I'm talking about social advantages which, in some ways, can be even more important than combat advantages because they would allow her to gain the aid or even loyalty of those who have there own skills. Let me break it down for you:
-She is "beautiful" a trait that grants her +4 to reaction rolls against anyone who is attracted to women whilst that obviously includes heterosexual men which is probably the main military demographic but also against women attracted to women, a group that's disproportionately large among military personnel.
-She gets +2 in reaction rolls because of charisma
-she gets +4 with all military personnel allied with the US
then she of course has courtesy rank 3, status 2, and wealthy plus a huge amount of languages and cultural familiarity

Now the skills I was talking about?
Administration (A) IQ-1 [1]-13; Body Language (A) Per-1 [1]-13; Detect Lies (H) Per-2 [1]-12; Diplomacy (H) IQ-1 [2]-13; Erotic Art (A) DX-1 [1]-13; Fast-Talk (A) IQ [2]-14;Intelligence Analysis (H) IQ+1 [8]-15; Interrogation (A) IQ [2]-14; Intimidation (A) Will [2]-14; Law (American Criminal; International) (H) IQ-2 [2]-12; Leadership (A) IQ [2]-14; Politics (A) IQ-1 [1]-13; Psychology (H) IQ-2 [1]-12; Public Speaking (A) IQ-1 [1]-13; Research (A) IQ [2]-14;Savoir-Faire (High Society; Mafia; Military; Police; Servant) (E) IQ [5]-14;Sex Appeal (A) HT [2]-12;Streetwise (A) IQ [2]-14; Writing (A) IQ-1 [1]-13

Personally my strategy would something like this:
- Get an investor, either by finding a particularly wealthy veteran or by publishing her experiences into a book and then using the fame and profit acquired to find an investor
- Poach personnel from old units by offering a better salary and benefits than current position, also hire some more mundane workers for whatever skills she lacks or time she doesn't have. Hell she could probably justify it to herself as looking out for them!
- negotiate a favorable contract with NATO alligned nations
- continue the cycle of accumulating money and hiring more personnel until she has plenty of personnel and money
- slowly shift the loyalty of her subordinates from there respective countries to her
- honestly at that point you can do whatever you want

Regardless, the real measure of character power isn't really what they can't do but what they can do. Also that she has the ability to accomplish the plan I described isn't really unrealistic at all. There are probably characters built on far less points that could also manage to pull off the plan I described.
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Old 04-14-2022, 11:24 PM   #50
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Default Re: Ideas for a New long-term Campaign

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Originally Posted by newton View Post
She's definitely not a combat monster in the capabilities she has for her CP I'd give you that much, she's too generalist for that. I'm talking about social advantages which, in some ways, can be even more important than combat advantages because they would allow her to gain the aid or even loyalty of those who have there own skills. Let me break it down for you:
-She is "beautiful" a trait that grants her +4 to reaction rolls against anyone who is attracted to women whilst that obviously includes heterosexual men which is probably the main military demographic but also against women attracted to women, a group that's disproportionately large among military personnel.
-She gets +2 in reaction rolls because of charisma
-she gets +4 with all military personnel allied with the US
then she of course has courtesy rank 3, status 2, and wealthy plus a huge amount of languages and cultural familiarity

Now the skills I was talking about?
Administration (A) IQ-1 [1]-13; Body Language (A) Per-1 [1]-13; Detect Lies (H) Per-2 [1]-12; Diplomacy (H) IQ-1 [2]-13; Erotic Art (A) DX-1 [1]-13; Fast-Talk (A) IQ [2]-14;Intelligence Analysis (H) IQ+1 [8]-15; Interrogation (A) IQ [2]-14; Intimidation (A) Will [2]-14; Law (American Criminal; International) (H) IQ-2 [2]-12; Leadership (A) IQ [2]-14; Politics (A) IQ-1 [1]-13; Psychology (H) IQ-2 [1]-12; Public Speaking (A) IQ-1 [1]-13; Research (A) IQ [2]-14;Savoir-Faire (High Society; Mafia; Military; Police; Servant) (E) IQ [5]-14;Sex Appeal (A) HT [2]-12;Streetwise (A) IQ [2]-14; Writing (A) IQ-1 [1]-13

Personally my strategy would something like this:
- Get an investor, either by finding a particularly wealthy veteran or by publishing her experiences into a book and then using the fame and profit acquired to find an investor
- Poach personnel from old units by offering a better salary and benefits than current position, also hire some more mundane workers for whatever skills she lacks or time she doesn't have. Hell she could probably justify it to herself as looking out for them!
- negotiate a favorable contract with NATO alligned nations
- continue the cycle of accumulating money and hiring more personnel until she has plenty of personnel and money
- slowly shift the loyalty of her subordinates from there respective countries to her
- honestly at that point you can do whatever you want

Regardless, the real measure of character power isn't really what they can't do but what they can do. Also that she has the ability to accomplish the plan I described isn't really unrealistic at all. There are probably characters built on far less points that could also manage to pull off the plan I described.
I understand. So do you think it would be a good idea for her to be a Russian spy, infiltrating some government institution, and trying to carry out the same plan? Or that this might be a good concept for her "archenemy"?
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