So... Mass Combat.

[Jürgen Hubert]

I will be soon starting a campaign that starts out as wilderness exploration but will eventually evolve with the PCs starting their own colony and turning it into a nation (for those who are interested in the background details, read the "Cold Frontier" posts listed here). And this will likely involve the GURPS Mass Combat rules, with which I have no experience - so I would like to hear about yours with the system. What worked, what didn't, and what would you do differently?

The Tech Level of the campaign is TL 3+2 - that is, a standard D&Desque fantasy setting without gunpowder, but with two added tech levels of "magitech" in the form of fairly common (but still expensive) magic items. Which will likely be in scarce supply on the frontier, but they likely will build a (golem-powered) railroad sooner or later (which raises the question of how fast a railroad can transport military units).

[Nereidalbel]

The speed of a railroad is entirely dependent on your engine output. Early steam locomotives only went between 5mph (8km/h) and 30mph (48km/h). If you want your magitech to cover a couple centuries of real-world refinement on the same engines, speeds in excess of 100mph (160.9km/h) are possible.

As for using golems to do more than keep a steam engine running without getting tired, that is limited entirely by the power levels of your mages in setting.

[Michele]

Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert

I will be soon starting a campaign that starts out as wilderness exploration but will eventually evolve with the PCs starting their own colony and turning it into a nation (for those who are interested in the background details, read the "Cold Frontier" posts listed here). And this will likely involve the GURPS Mass Combat rules, with which I have no experience - so I would like to hear about yours with the system. What worked, what didn't, and what would you do differently?

Low Tech worked nicely. High Tech could get complicated, unless the GM has done a lot of homework in advance (and there is, in that case, the danger of ...railroading).
It's nice if the PCs have to command relatively small "armies". I don't see much point in having them as full generals, because then, they'd be working full-time for the army, where's the adventuring time?
And, IMHO, always play out the scenes when they get themselves in danger in order to improve their sides' chances of victory. Give them a fighting chance, even when they roll very badly (anything short of a critical failure). Nobody likes to be told: "Your hero was just hit by a stray bullet and died on the spot".

[Jürgen Hubert]

Originally Posted by Michele

Low Tech worked nicely. High Tech could get complicated, unless the GM has done a lot of homework in advance (and there is, in that case, the danger of ...railroading).
It's nice if the PCs have to command relatively small "armies". I don't see much point in having them as full generals, because then, they'd be working full-time for the army, where's the adventuring time?

Political intrigue and fighting the monsters no one else can fight.

One player compared the campaign to Babylon 5 - many of the protagonists commanded soldiers and other people under arms, yet there was no shortage of trouble the protagonists themselves ended in.

[Michele]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

Early steam locomotives only went between 5mph (8km/h) and 30mph (48km/h). If you want your magitech to cover a couple centuries of real-world refinement on the same engines, speeds in excess of 100mph (160.9km/h) are possible.

The problem here is all the time that doesn't go into just steaming along.

Entrain and detrain the troops. Form up the train, what shunting facilities do you have? Build pressure. Refuel. Maintenance. Secure speed through enemy-raided areas. Repairs to the line when that enemy has indeed messed with it. Etc.

[Lamech]

I have a little experience with the system, but it very quickly popped up one problem. Unless you want a lot of combat, split the party war scenes you shouldn't play out every action the heroes take to help in the battle. On the other hand, it is annoying for the PCs to take life threatening wounds from the dice rolls. Certainly realistic and gritty, especially in modern combat, but its something I personally would avoid.

So for my solution. I would play out a combat scene when the rules say the PCs take damage. When that happens instead have it mean the PC screwed up and is now in danger.

Also don't forget the need for sanity on the fly adjustments. If a player does something epic, make it affect the battle, even if it doesn't quite fit into the rules. If a PC ghost is effectively immune to the enemy and inflicts major causalities its going to have a major affect. Feel free add direct casualties, force a route or whatever. Nor are the rules appropriate for a battle between firebreathing dragons and swordsmen. The dragons will roast the swordsmen from beyond their range. The army of swordsmen auto-loses.

[Vynticator]

+1 to the idea of active roleplayed interventions featuring as many party members as possible. Think of it like Total War games; the Mass Combat elements should be set up so the strategy map ('abstracted stats, zoomed out') is highly challenging, and the battle is looking very risky. So the party interventions (the 'zoomed in' elements) should be crucial; I would include:
- recruitment of extra forces for the PC side of the war via diplomatic or heroic means
- training and equipping home forces and defensive structures
- reconnaissance using Intel Analysis
- disruption of transport and supply lines
- planning the defences/assault
- assisting with engineering works
- pre-battle sabotage of significant enemy assets (assassination, destruction of materiel, poisoning supplies, turning assets to divide the forces via persuasion, bribery, blackmail etc.)
- mid-battle interventions to turn the tide at crucial moments (when the elite heavy infantry get deployed, when the cavalry threaten to flank the wavering unit, when the fliers swoop out of the clouds, or whatever fits your setting)

Ensure the PCs are 'invested' in the action so even the abstracted dicerolls feel emotionally and intellectually significant.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

The speed of a railroad is entirely dependent on your engine output.

Not entirely. In many cases there are also limits to how fast the train can safely go on a given track.

Golems seem to have power output that's comparable to a living creature of similar mass, which is pretty lousy by engine standards.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Golems seem to have power output that's comparable to a living creature of similar mass, which is pretty lousy by engine standards.

Depends. They can at least concentrate a fair bit of power into a small-ish package.

I think that a 8,000 lbs. iron golem of slighty over human-size can fairly easily tote his own weight at speeds of up to 10 mph while walking, so if they are outside the train, they might drag far more than that over tracks at similar speeds.

Which is not too shabby, compared to oxen and wagons, at least.

[Jürgen Hubert]

Note that these are not standard golems as described in GURPS Magic. In this world, golems can appear in pretty much any shape, and some were constructed in the form of locomotives.

The details need not concern us here, though if there is interest I can open up a separate thread.