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Old 01-24-2022, 04:07 PM   #51
Anthony
 
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Default Re: Vacc Suits

If you do the math for how long it takes a habitat to lose enough pressure to worry about, it turns out any disaster large enough to actually require things like rescue balls probably kills everyone inside the habitat before they have the chance to use the rescue balls, so I suspect emergency training focuses heavily on "here's how you deploy a portable patch", not anything directly related to pressure suits.
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Old 01-25-2022, 06:01 PM   #52
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Default Re: Vacc Suits

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If you do the math for how long it takes a habitat to lose enough pressure to worry about, it turns out any disaster large enough to actually require things like rescue balls probably kills everyone inside the habitat before they have the chance to use the rescue balls, so I suspect emergency training focuses heavily on "here's how you deploy a portable patch", not anything directly related to pressure suits.
Yeah. Providing rescue balls in case of an air leak would be like providing a fire proximity suit with SCBA in every bedroom in case of a house fire. Pressure-and-O₂ alarm and a set of patches would be cheaper and actually useful, but in practice far from everyone has a smoke alarm and fire extinguisher.
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Old 01-25-2022, 06:33 PM   #53
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Yeah. Providing rescue balls in case of an air leak would be like providing a fire proximity suit with SCBA in every bedroom in case of a house fire. Pressure-and-O₂ alarm and a set of patches would be cheaper and actually useful, but in practice far from everyone has a smoke alarm and fire extinguisher.
In this environment, at least some neighborhood associations might make that a legal requirement, not to keep you safe but to keep your neighbors safe.
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Old 01-25-2022, 07:50 PM   #54
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[SNIP]

A lot of what people rely on for protection is bulkheading and rooms that can be sealed and pressurized. For small leaks, sealant kits are widely available, provided by neighborhood associations (a cross between a condo association and a town government). (Question: What skill would be used for that sort of damage control? The sealant kits would be designed to be simple to use, with skill bonuses, but there ought to be some basic skill requirement.)
What skill do you require for the use of tape? Because that should be all that is necessary. Maybe a can of spray sealant for something major. That might require knowing how to make or use a backing tool that goes through a hole and is then opened and pulled against the outside surface while the foam is being applied from the pressurized side.
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Old 01-26-2022, 06:52 AM   #55
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That seems almost absurdly cheap. The TL7 suit in the Basic Set is $2 million (which is apparently less expensive than real space suits have been!) and the TL9 ones based on mechanical compression are around $10,000. I wonder what the difference in assumptions is?
My guess is mass production vs. limited runs/prototypes, very mature technology, and generous assumptions regarding TL9 materials, miniaturization, and manufacturing tech.

The big deal would be a relatively cheap, highly-reliable multi-layered material which incorporates the best elements of Spandex (skin-tight and flexible), Aramid Fiber (damage resistance, Gore-Tex (breathability), and neoprene rubber (airtight seal), possibly with inherent "self-healing" capabilities which automatically close any micro-breaches in the material. Combine that with inherent temperature control systems for long-term comfort.

The whole thing might be a spin-off of military battlesuit, spacesuit, or walker R&D 1 or 2 generations before.
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Old 01-26-2022, 07:06 AM   #56
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I know what it is like to wear a catheter - and trust me, it is NOT fun. You couldn't get me to wear a suit that handles body wastes if you PAID me to. Those poor folks are going to have to get used to such things - and one byproduct of a catheter that is badly installed, is permanent scar tissue forming in your bladder that you will never be able to get away from for the rest of our life (barring any further advances in medicine in that area).
Space toilets use fans to pull waste into a storage container which could sort of be modified for spacesuits. Short-term duration suits might just allow urine collection, which is easy enough to handle with existing pilot waste relief systems and a low-powered, demand-activated pump. Budget models might just use high quality adult diapers.
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Old 01-26-2022, 09:57 AM   #57
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Default Re: Vacc Suits

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If you do the math for how long it takes a habitat to lose enough pressure to worry about, it turns out any disaster large enough to actually require things like rescue balls probably kills everyone inside the habitat before they have the chance to use the rescue balls, so I suspect emergency training focuses heavily on "here's how you deploy a portable patch", not anything directly related to pressure suits.
Rescue balls could still be common, both for political reasons (e.g. if you have passengers, it makes the passengers feel safer), and to have them available for those very rare incidents where they're actually useful (which is arguably also a political reason, but not a purely political reason).
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Old 01-27-2022, 08:19 AM   #58
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Space toilets use fans to pull waste into a storage container which could sort of be modified for spacesuits. Short-term duration suits might just allow urine collection, which is easy enough to handle with existing pilot waste relief systems and a low-powered, demand-activated pump. Budget models might just use high quality adult diapers.
The external male catheter described there is what I generally assume powered armor/environmental suits/etc to use, albeit built into the suit (so probably no need for an adhesive to stick it to the skin; you probably want disposable ones for sanitary reasons, however, so something to secure it to the suit would be necessary). I think something similar would work for women, although adhesive to stick to the skin may be necessary there, but some other method of securely holding it in place should work.

For longer-term use, you'd need something for dealing with solid wastes*. This is normally portrayed as a tube going into the rectum; I wonder if an external system might work there as well? Possibly with a built-in flushing system/bidet? I suspect that's not as much of a concern here, where the suits are meant to be used for emergencies, and unless something goes terribly wrong (or you're unlucky enough that the disaster occurs while you're on the way to the restroom) you typically wouldn't need to use the facilities.

*I wonder if powered-armor soldiers might opt to switch to a liquid-only diet for a few days preceding a mission, and stick to liquid-only rations for the duration of a mission, to avoid needing to "go number two." I'm not sure if that would actually work, however.
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Old 01-27-2022, 09:38 AM   #59
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*I wonder if powered-armor soldiers might opt to switch to a liquid-only diet for a few days preceding a mission, and stick to liquid-only rations for the duration of a mission, to avoid needing to "go number two." I'm not sure if that would actually work, however.
Personal experience while dealing with a medical condition says "For a limited time". In the vicinity of 3 days to 3 weeks.
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Old 01-27-2022, 10:49 AM   #60
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Personal experience while dealing with a medical condition says "For a limited time". In the vicinity of 3 days to 3 weeks.
Sounds like it might be an option if your powered soldiers are used like the HEAT in Deathworlders - sent in for a relatively short-term mission but with a decent amount of prep beforehand, with longer periods of time between missions. Upcoming mission? Switch to a liquid diet a few days before, do the mission, then switch back to solids once you've returned. This assumes a liquid diet doesn't cause any issues that would negatively impact performance (which could include morale effects, although the morale hit of "No steak" may be offset by the morale gain of "No fecal waste disposal tube"). But this is probably a digression.
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