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Old 04-21-2013, 01:23 PM   #1
adimar
 
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Default Are Talents overpowered?

I'm trying to work on a Traveler spaceship pilot and came across the "Hot Pilot" talent.
This seems very overpowered since for all "piloting" needs it replaces both DX, IQ and high skill levels.
The actual question is in regards to talents in general.
Are they way overpowered? Even a low level talent say 2 or 3 levels would make a character into an amazing "...." fill in the blank when coupled with a minor investment in skills.
(and enable the character to bypass the expensive gurps 4e attributes)

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Old 04-21-2013, 01:28 PM   #2
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

I personaly dont think so. I prefer that a pc takes a talent than a higher attribute in most cases. Consider that I also dont see a problem in weapons talents and in talent levels above 4.
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Old 04-21-2013, 01:28 PM   #3
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

Talents are good.
Talents stop everyone maxing out IQ and Dex and becoming cookie cutter copies of each other.

If only I could persuade my players to take talents that weren't Magery.
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Old 04-21-2013, 01:29 PM   #4
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

I don't think so in general. Without some attribute investment to go along with them a couple of point's boosted doesn't unbalance anything. 5 point talents can be potent, so player created ones should be extra-carefully evaluated.
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Old 04-21-2013, 01:41 PM   #5
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

Since skills and skill bonuses (Talents and attributes) aren't priced based on how useful they are in GURPS, you'll find that this wildly varies by the particular skills.

Some skills (like Stealth or Diplomacy) are really good and might be worth 5/level all on their own, while others (like most Hobby Skills) are nearly worthless.

So, it's possible to end up with Talents where the price is many times different from what the skills it contains would be worth if they were priced based on how useful they are.

Imagine a Talent that includes the six best skills in the game (whatever you think those are). It might be worth 30/level. Obviously, that's a steal at only 5/level.

Now imagine a Talent that includes the six worst skills in the game. It might not be worth even a single point. A bad deal even at only 5/level.

Talents do exacerbate this more than straight attributes, since with attributes the price is factored to include the most useful and least useful skills in the game, which kind of evens out if you're grabbing from skills of different power levels (in theory anyway), but with Talents you can skip all the skills you don't want and grab only the skills you want.

Do note that buying the useless skills as part of a Talent is still the best deal if you want those skills and don't want the attribute, since they still all cost 4/level to raise individually. A Talent is always a huge price reduction from the alternative.

This is all a result of GURPS pricing skills based on their trait type rather than usefulness, which is how everything else in the system is handled.
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Old 04-21-2013, 02:02 PM   #6
vicky_molokh
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

I feel Talents aren't all that overpowered. Some are quite good if your concept matches one very well, and taking the attribute isn't a better deal. E.g. even with PU2:Talents, I couldn't find a good deal for a pedagogue of any sort, and particularly for a physical-oriented instructor. Settled for a custom-made Pedagogue talent. I still feel that making a competent sports instructor (and post-biomod-installation recovery specialist) is way more expensive than an equally competent negotiator/psychologist/social interface.
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Old 04-21-2013, 02:33 PM   #7
Anthony
 
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

Talents range from amazing to terrible depending on exactly what skills and reaction rolls they modify. 10 or 15 point talents that only apply to a single stat (e.g. Artificer, Business Acumen, Healer, Mathematical Ability, Outdoorsman, Smooth Operator) are mostly terrible (there's a case for Business Acumen due to who its reaction bonus applies to). 5 point talents, and 10 talents that apply to both IQ and DX, are usually good deals.
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Old 04-21-2013, 02:52 PM   #8
ericthered
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

I see talents as a core part of the game, and one of the things that puts the 'GU' in GURPS.

I do think blatant abuse can be unbalancing, but the GM's job is to avoid that, not the rules, as many pre-made talents exist. Its also not too hard to see if a talent has a theme to it or not.

As for if the 10 or 15 point talents are worth it, The only reason they're not is because IQ! is 10 points and DX! is 15. Thats probably why I like myGurps's house rule of will and per seperate from IQ.

If anything, talents are less powerful than I'd like them. I'd like to see them as the go to for most mental skills, with IQ an expensive and very versatile buy.
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Old 04-21-2013, 03:07 PM   #9
Sunrunners_Fire
 
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

Quote:
Originally Posted by adimar View Post
I'm trying to work on a Traveler spaceship pilot and came across the "Hot Pilot" talent.
This seems very overpowered since for all "piloting" needs it replaces both DX, IQ and high skill levels.
The actual question is in regards to talents in general.
Are they way overpowered? Even a low level talent say 2 or 3 levels would make a character into an amazing "...." fill in the blank when coupled with a minor investment in skills.
(and enable the character to bypass the expensive gurps 4e attributes)
If talents were overpowered, my players would take them more (often | without my prompting).
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Old 04-21-2013, 03:12 PM   #10
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Default Re: Are Talents overpowered?

In an exceptionally good investigation game I ran many moons ago my most munchkin of players made up a specific Detective Talent that cost 5 points. It was most iconic and useful information gather skills he could think of.

This was the height of munchkinism, but it meant all the skill rolls were formalities and we could get on with talking to people and them figuring out the missing bits of the story. They wanted to use the skills as a last resort.


This was the same charcter that made me hate Targeted Attack (pistol shot/foot).
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