Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-08-2010, 11:05 AM   #11
Edges
 
Edges's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: GMT-5
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Plus, they're easy to make/improvise.
Edges is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 11:09 AM   #12
trooper6
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Medford, MA
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Why is cheap awesome...besides being cheap? You can add lots of those extras to quality. Balanced and Fine...maybe even ornate. Nice!
trooper6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:02 PM   #13
Carlos
 
Carlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Campos dos Goytacazes - RJ - Brazil
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
1) Some armour protect better against cutting than crushing
That's right. Some armors give more protection against cutting than crushing. However, this is just a little diference like two or three extra DR to cutting, which is nothing if you think that the cutting attacks will have a +50% extra damage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
2) Crushing does more knockback
Ok, but I don't think that's really great to throw away your opponent one or two yards back. The cutting's damage modifier is better than knockback because it's deadlier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
3) Crushing does more blunt trauma
Yes, but the +50% extra damage still overpower the blunt trauma damage and not all armors are flexible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
4) When you hit people in the skull, crushing is just as good as cutting (x4)
Yes. Any attack on the skull is x4, even a punch or a kick!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
5) Crushing does more damage against skeletons and liche's.
I didn't know that on GURPS. Ok, but all the creatures in the world takes more damage from a cutting weapon than smashing weapons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
6) A heavier weapons means more weapons will have to roll against breaking if they parry it (or might not be able to at all).
Maul = 12 lbs.
Great Axe = 8 lbs.

The Maul is heavier than the Great Axe, but the difference is not THAT great.
Carlos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:09 PM   #14
mlangsdorf
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Austin, TX
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

The difference between a Maul and a Great Axe isn't that large in absolute terms, but the game effects are crucial. A Great Axe can only break short swords, hatchets, knives, and fencing weapons. A Maul can break all of those and spears, axes, staffs, and broadswords. That's a really significant difference, moving from "weapons people don't normally use" to "common weapons".

A great axe doesn't do more damage if it always gets parried. A maul that breaks the foe's weapon is more likely to do damage on the next hit.
mlangsdorf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:12 PM   #15
Landwalker
 
Landwalker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Cumberland, ME
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
The Maul is heavier than the Great Axe, but the difference is not THAT great.
That's actually a pretty significant difference. For purposes of breakage, it means that a Maul has the chance to break all of the following weapons that a Great Axe doesn't:

Axe, Broadsword (and Thrusting Broadsword), Small Mace, Pick, Light Club, Cavalry Saber, Quarterstaff, Spear, Rapier, Small Axe, Small Round Mace, Hook Sword, Backsword, Mensurschlager, Bokken, Estoc, Jian, Longsword, Edged Rapier, Late Katana, and Falchion.
Landwalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:39 PM   #16
Landwalker
 
Landwalker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Cumberland, ME
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Follow-up: Of course, here's the question I really want to know the answer to:

Why would any character use one of the ‡ Two-handed Axe/Mace weapons ("THAMs") instead of the Dueling Polearms from Martial Arts?

("Not having access to Martial Arts" isn't a valid reason.)

Both groups of weapons are cheap—the most expensive, the Dueling Halberd, is $120, versus the $100 for a Great Axe/Warhammer, a Dueling Bill, or a Dueling Pollaxe and $80 for a Maul or Dueling Glaive.

Both groups of weapons deal comparable damage—a Dueling Halberd gets Sw+4 cut and Sw+3 imp or cr (if you replace the pick with a hammer), which puts it right in line with the Maul, Great Axe, and Warhammer (combined). The Dueling Poleaxe is right alongside it at sw+3 cut and sw+3 cr, again putting it on par with the THAM weapons, while the Dueling Bill (sw+2 cut / thr+3 imp / thr-1 cr) and Dueling Glaive (sw+2 cut / thr+3 imp) are close behind.

Both groups of weapons have comparable weights—the heaviest polearm is the 10-pound Dueling Halberd, so the 12-pound Maul has a slight advantage there (in that it can break 4-pound weapons, most notably the quarterstaff and the axe). The Dueling Poleaxe has the same 8-pound weight as the Great Axe. Dueling Glaives and Bills are only six pounds, putting them just behind the Warhammer and the lightest of the bunch. Still, pretty close overall.

Both groups of weapons have comparable reach and parry—pretty much all of the weapons in both groups are Reach 1,2* and Parry 0U, but the Dueling Polearms have the edge here due to their thrust options, which have Parry 0.

So what's the only significant difference?—Dueling Polearms are single-dagger Min ST weapons, while THAMs are double-dagger, and becoming unready after an attack is a brutal, brutal disadvantage. THAMs can only attack every other turn. THAMs can't use the Rapid Recovery option from Extra Effort to attack and parry in the same turn. In order to use a THAM with the same "readiness" efficacy as a Dueling Polearm, you have to have at least ST 18. But even if you do have ST 18 (or 20 for a Maul), there's still no compelling reason why you shouldn't just take that ST 18-20 and use it to swing around a Dueling Polearm, and you can be swinging around that Dueling Polearm much, much earlier in the ST progression just as well.

So, the real question is: Why in the world, from a mechanical standpoint, would anybody pick a THAM over a Dueling Polearm?
Landwalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:40 PM   #17
Ragitsu
Banned
 
Ragitsu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Portland, Oregon
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos View Post
Ok, but I don't think that's really great to throw away your opponent one or two yards back. The cutting's damage modifier is better than knockback because it's deadlier.
There are some downsides, to be sure, but you can keep a deadly enemy back in order to free some room, or knock an enemy off an edge.
Ragitsu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:45 PM   #18
Icelander
 
Icelander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Landwalker View Post
So, the real question is: Why in the world, from a mechanical standpoint, would anybody pick a THAM over a Dueling Polearm?
Because they do more damage?

I know, I know; this is not the fact in the Basic Set or Martial Arts. To be frank, that is an error that has but recently (with playtesting) been discovered.

Cabaret Chicks on Ice will provide.
__________________
Za uspiekh nashevo beznadiozhnovo diela!
Icelander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:46 PM   #19
sir_pudding
Wielder of Smart Pants
 
sir_pudding's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Landwalker View Post
So, the real question is: Why in the world, from a mechanical standpoint, would anybody pick a THAM over a Dueling Polearm?
Low-Tech will give them a damage bump apparently, and warhammers at least do impaling damage.
sir_pudding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2010, 01:48 PM   #20
Ragitsu
Banned
 
Ragitsu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Portland, Oregon
Default Re: Heavy crushing/smashing weapons: Why use them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Icelander View Post
Cabaret Chicks on Ice will provide.
That's a pretty vague reference.
Ragitsu is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cabaret chicks on ice, combat rules, low tech

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:35 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.