[DF] Armor Cost and Low Tech

[Jabani]

I'm perusing Low Tech and trying to decide for my GURPS Ptolus campaign - basically Dungeon Fantasy in a city with the dungeon itself underneath - how I want to deal with armor.

I like the detail of LT, but the price increase is substantial. Might not be a bad thing, as it gives the PCs more of a 'low level' feel (we're starting at 175 points rather than 250). Then again, it's a group inexperienced in GURPS and could probably benefit from some beefier protection from the get go. On the third hand, I purposely went with 175 over 150 to give them a boost, as the challenges will still be set primarily along the 150 axis until the adjust to the game system, so maybe they won't need more protection.

Ultimately, the general question is, which cost scheme is more fitting for DF, Low Tech or Basic?

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Jabani

Ultimately, the general question is, which cost scheme is more fitting for DF, Low Tech or Basic?

If you start with Munitions Grade armor and Flat-Topped Spangenhelms you get basically the same costs as Basic Set armor.

[Jabani]

Right but then the DR goes down. Take the Mail Hauberk from Basic: DR 4/2* for $230 becomes Fine Mail in LT, either the same DR for $900, or DR 3/1* for $360. Worse protection and still substantially more expensive. Mail is a particularly egregious example, but almost all of the armor does less for the same price, so the issue still remains.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Jabani

Right but then the DR goes down. Take the Mail Hauberk from Basic: DR 4/2* for $230 becomes Fine Mail in LT, either the same DR for $900, or DR 3/1* for $360. Worse protection and still substantially more expensive. Mail is a particularly egregious example, but almost all of the armor does less for the same price, so the issue still remains.

The realistic armor has significantly less weight, though.

[The Colonel]

If you are dungeon crawling in a DF style, go with the DF prices and weights - you're likely to end up with a combat heavy game in which the PCs will need less than authentic armour to function.

If your campaign was going for more realism then you might want the LT armour stats instead - especially since heavy armour is unlikely to be very popular in a city.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by The Colonel

If you are dungeon crawling in a DF style, go with the DF prices and weights - you're likely to end up with a combat heavy game in which the PCs will need less than authentic armour to function.

I've used the LT armor tables without issue in DF.

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Jabani

Right but then the DR goes down. Take the Mail Hauberk from Basic: DR 4/2* for $230 becomes Fine Mail in LT, either the same DR for $900, or DR 3/1* for $360. Worse protection and still substantially more expensive. Mail is a particularly egregious example, but almost all of the armor does less for the same price, so the issue still remains.

You're overlooking the cheap Heavy Mail, which has the same protection as a Basic Set Mail Hauberk and weighs 28% less. It does cost more than twice as much at $480. (If you're in anything-goes mode you can do better on money and protection at a small weight penalty by going to Mail and Plates.)

[mlangsdorf]

You may want to just handwave that generations of delving or whatever means that there's lots of armor salvage on the market, and as such armor prices in general are halved and certain enhancements (I'm looking at you, Master Tailoring!) are much less expensive.

My experience in running a DF game was that increasing the price of armor by a factor of 10 to reduce the weight by 25% was not a very good deal. It's not enough savings on the cheap/light armor and its too insanely expensive for the really good armor.

[DanHoward]

Doesn't a typical dungeon crawl involve stealing piles of treasure from unsuspecting denizens? How long would it take to amass a few thousand $ worth of treasure? How hard is it for a GM to reduce the potential hazard of the first few encounters until PCs can upgrade their initial armour?

[Kazander]

Sure, but current pricing in LT isn't economically consistent with DF.

Why would anyone pay x30 for their armor to get the weight reduced by 30% (Masterful Tailoring), when they could pay to get it Lightened by an enchanter for $100 (25%), or $10,000 for 50%? Even $10,000 is cheaper than Masterful Tailoring for a full suit that costs $350 or more (i.e. almost anything).

I'd like to see pricing on enhancements redone so there is some consistency across the purely mundane (Hardened Steel, Masterful Tailoring), the exotic (Dragonhide, Dwarven Plate), and the Magical (Fortify (+1DR is only $50!), Deflect, etc). Right now the mundane options are available, but in any simulated Fantasy economy a lot of them would never be used because of the exorbitant costs....and thus they wouldn't really exist since there'd be no demand for them.